Entitlements Discussion

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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:04 am

Nano wrote:Hopefully, SS is still around and doing well...in 2060.


****.



Claim zero all year, then take what you over pay and put it in a Roth account.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:10 am

mdb1958 wrote:
Nano wrote:Hopefully, SS is still around and doing well...in 2060.


****.



Claim zero all year, then take what you over pay and put it in a Roth account.

Or, claim the appropriate amount, only pay what you should, and put that money into an interest-bearing account instead of giving the government a free loan.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Cheb » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:45 am

bucfanclw wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:

Claim zero all year, then take what you over pay and put it in a Roth account.

Or, claim the appropriate amount, only pay what you should, and put that money into an interest-bearing account instead of giving the government a free loan.


That requires more self discipline and legwork. Mdb's method makes one hide money from oneself, which is a sound strategy.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby deltbucs » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:56 am

mdb1958 wrote:
Nano wrote:Hopefully, SS is still around and doing well...in 2060.


****.



Claim zero all year, then take what you over pay and put it in a Roth account.

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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri Jun 08, 2018 11:00 am

I go the much simpler route of giving a fake SS # to my employer and claiming 33 dependents so they withhold no money from my paycheck.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Stuart » Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:03 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:I go the much simpler route of giving a fake SS # to my employer and claiming 33 dependents so they withhold no money from my paycheck.


your last names not sanchez is it?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby HamBone » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:19 pm

Betsy wrote:Count on yourself.


Great advice. We'd be better off if we did this...as a nation.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Deuce » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:21 pm

HamBone wrote:
Betsy wrote:Count on yourself.


Great advice. We'd be better off if we did this...as a nation.


It's not that I disagree with the points Betsy is making (in a couple of threads). But they all sound like cliches taken off of cat posters or something.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby HamBone » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:23 pm

Deuce wrote:
HamBone wrote:
Great advice. We'd be better off if we did this...as a nation.


It's not that I disagree with the points Betsy is making (in a couple of threads). But they all sound like cliches taken off of cat posters or something.


Maybe we should all live our lives IAW cat posters...how much worse could things be?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:25 pm

If you guys are talking LOLZcats I’m in!!!
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:55 pm

bucfanclw wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:

Claim zero all year, then take what you over pay and put it in a Roth account.

Or, claim the appropriate amount, only pay what you should, and put that money into an interest-bearing account instead of giving the government a free loan.



Your way, if you ever grow it into a vast amount you will pay taxes on the interest.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Rocker » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:20 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:If you guys are talking LOLZcats I’m in!!!


Icanhazcheezburger?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:26 pm

mdb1958 wrote:
bucfanclw wrote:Or, claim the appropriate amount, only pay what you should, and put that money into an interest-bearing account instead of giving the government a free loan.



Your way, if you ever grow it into a vast amount you will pay taxes on the interest.

Because its income... are you actually saying you would rather not earn interest because you would have to pay taxes on what you earned?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:10 am

bucfanclw wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:

Your way, if you ever grow it into a vast amount you will pay taxes on the interest.

Because its income... are you actually saying you would rather not earn interest because you would have to pay taxes on what you earned?



Tax-Free withdrawals
Unlike traditional IRA withdrawals, qualified Roth IRA withdrawals are federal-income-tax-free and usually state-income-tax-free too. What is a qualified withdrawal? It’s one that is taken after you, as the Roth account owner, have met both of the following requirements:

1. You’ve had at least one Roth IRA open for over five years.

2. You’ve reached age 59½ or become disabled or dead.

Also, you can set up multiple Roth accounts to leave to whoever after you die - grandkids???

The interest is taxable every year (your way), the gains in a Roth are not. You can put 5,500 a year into Roth account(s). Once your on a fixed income and say you have way more than enough in a retirement portfolio, you can spend as you wish without taxation if it is a Roth. You want a 100,000 grand just to run around the country or where ever (you wont pay taxes on it).



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Talk to your tax adviser before pulling the trigger on a conversion — just to make sure you’ve considered all the relevant factors.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:29 am

Roth IRAs are not some tax-free loophole. You've already paid the taxes on that income by the time you put it in a Roth IRA. If you set up an automatic deposit with every pay check into a Roth IRA, you'd be putting the same amount in, but you'd be earning interest all year instead of waiting until your tax refund comes to drop in the lump sum.

I don't know how I can put it more simply for you.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:52 am

Ok, with your planning, how much money will you have to save to live on say - $50,000 a year.

$25,000
$12,500
Last edited by mdb1958 on Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:59 am

Does anyone have retirement accounts yielding 1.7% interest?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:14 am

Right now if you put 10 grand in a 5 yr CD at 2.75% - what you make about $1,300 for five years? just guessing...

hundred grand? $13,000?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby Zarniwoop » Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:34 am

mdb1958 wrote:Right now if you put 10 grand in a 5 yr CD at 2.75% - what you make about $1,300 for five years? just guessing...

hundred grand? $13,000?





I'm guessing

$23,234,564,858,939,049,234,111,595,684,493,359,394,044,030.88


am i close?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:25 am

Let's say you get paid every 2 weeks. There are 15 paychecks left in the year. Just for the sake of round numbers, let's say they take out $20 extra every paycheck thanks to your cunning plan to claim 0. I'll set up an auto transfer of that $20 to a Roth IRA making a measly 1.5%.

February 2019 comes around when Uncle Sam pays you back the money you loaned him so you get $300 to put in your Roth IRA. Since I've been contributing this whole time, my Roth IRA already has $345.10
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:50 am

bucfanclw wrote:Let's say you get paid every 2 weeks. There are 15 paychecks left in the year. Just for the sake of round numbers, let's say they take out $20 extra every paycheck thanks to your cunning plan to claim 0. I'll set up an auto transfer of that $20 to a Roth IRA making a measly 1.5%.

February 2019 comes around when Uncle Sam pays you back the money you loaned him so you get $300 to put in your Roth IRA. Since I've been contributing this whole time, my Roth IRA already has $345.10




A reasonable rate of return would be 6%.

Let me add this because you misunderstood. I would be taking out the max that I could afford weekly or bi-weekly plus the big bump at the end of the year. One year when I was in 401K land I did 10% - that will shock the ole weekly check I tell ya. Hey, I survived.

I never was able to put the max allowable, but if anyone (young) can put away 5 thou a year, you will make a lot of money in the long run.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:47 am

mdb1958 wrote:
bucfanclw wrote:Let's say you get paid every 2 weeks. There are 15 paychecks left in the year. Just for the sake of round numbers, let's say they take out $20 extra every paycheck thanks to your cunning plan to claim 0. I'll set up an auto transfer of that $20 to a Roth IRA making a measly 1.5%.

February 2019 comes around when Uncle Sam pays you back the money you loaned him so you get $300 to put in your Roth IRA. Since I've been contributing this whole time, my Roth IRA already has $345.10




A reasonable rate of return would be 6%.

Then I would have about $360.40, you would still only have $300.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:42 pm

I thought you were against Roth's? You better go back to your meme's.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:30 pm

mdb1958 wrote:I thought you were against Roth's? You better go back to your meme's.

No... go back and re-read. I'm saying claiming zero to give more money to Uncle Sam is stupid when you could be earning interest on that money.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:28 pm

bucfanclw wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:I thought you were against Roth's? You better go back to your meme's.

No... go back and re-read. I'm saying claiming zero to give more money to Uncle Sam is stupid when you could be earning interest on that money.


Explain your first post where you say put it in an interest-bearing acc. What % int did it bring you? Is this a savings acc. or a retirement acc. that a company matches and how much do they match?
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:16 pm

mdb1958 wrote:
bucfanclw wrote:No... go back and re-read. I'm saying claiming zero to give more money to Uncle Sam is stupid when you could be earning interest on that money.


Explain your first post where you say put it in an interest-bearing acc. What % int did it bring you? Is this a savings acc. or a retirement acc. that a company matches and how much do they match?

An account (savings, money market IRA, etc.) that earns interest. You can either claim 0 on your I9 and give extra money to the government that they will refund to you in a year with no interest earned, or you can claim the maximum allowable deductions, get that money on your paycheck, and put it directly into whatever the hell you want to actually earn something on it. This has nothing to do with your 401k, just your tax filing.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:11 pm

So you got no company matching your investing, how can I argue with that. I already know older people griping that the IRS wants them to send in a check. Do it your way, fine with me.

Either way, what we would like to happen is to save a bunch of money for when we get old. Just remember all the growth with the Roth isnt taxable.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:35 am

Roth IRA Contribution Limits for Individuals 50 or Older
For those age 50 or older, the same $5,500 contribution limit across all Roth IRAs is in place. However, the IRS also allows these individuals to also contribute an additional $1,000 as “catch up” contributions. Although this allowance is provided to assist individuals who are behind in retirement savings, it is available to everyone age 50 or over who qualifies for a Roth IRA.


Additional Roth IRA Contribution Information
Individuals may contribute money to a Roth IRA from January 1 of the current tax year to April 15 of the following tax year (in 2018, the date is April 17). Contributions are made with post-tax dollars. You pay tax today so that no tax is charged to you for withdrawals you make in retirement.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby bucfanclw » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:41 am

I'm done trying to help you understand a simple concept. Please continue your scheme of giving the government interest-free loans.
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Re: Entitlements Discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:57 am

bucfanclw wrote:I'm done trying to help you understand a simple concept. Please continue your scheme of giving the government interest-free loans.



Pay it now or die before you have to pay it later. Add 50,000 dollars worth of int you talk about growing, pay taxes on it then get back to me. It will be fun when your still bringing in a check but you will enjoy it even more when you no longer have one coming in.
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