Can we agree? Episode 1

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Do you agree that doubling down on the comment was idiotic?

Yes
10
77%
No
3
23%
 
Total votes : 13

Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Zarniwoop » Thu May 03, 2018 9:55 am

So in West Virginia one of the leading conservative candidates for senate, Don Blankenship, referred to Mitch McConnel's (D) father as a "wealthy china person".

When pressed on his use of this awkward phrase Blankenship doubled down and said the terminology is appropriate.


So today's very direct, simple question with no qualifications needed whatsoever -- do you think doubling down on that phrase was idiotic?



Here's more to the story....http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/04/26/d ... on-comment
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Buc2 » Thu May 03, 2018 10:07 am

I voted yes. It was a very ignorant statement. I'm as loyal to my country as any American and my father was born in and a citizen of Egypt at the time of my birth. The insinuation by Blankenship was, as McConnell said, ridiculous. Blankenship basically has stated that it is his belief that anyone with a family member having citizenship outside of America cannot be trusted to hold our country's best interests. Total bullshit. Perhaps it will play to his base, but I wouldn't bet on it.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Ken Carson » Thu May 03, 2018 10:09 am

McConnell's father-in-law is an American. It's stupid.

Thought I'm glad to see we've gotten better and upgraded the sexist 'chinaman' to 'china person.' Small victories.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Buc2 » Thu May 03, 2018 10:11 am

Ken Carson wrote:McConnell's father-in-law is an American. It's stupid.

Thought I'm glad to see we've gotten better and upgraded the sexist 'chinaman' to 'china person.' Small victories.

I didn't know the nationality of his FIL. I assumed it was Chinese. That makes Blankenship's comment even more ridiculous if that's even possible.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Zarniwoop » Thu May 03, 2018 10:12 am

I voted yes, as well....

My personal take -- I have no idea of Blankenship's background or his ideology. When he said "China Person" it reminded me of something folks from my grandparent's generation would say. For most of them that term wasn't racist...it was just awkward.

I have no idea if Blankenship deserves such leniency .... but it seems to me that him simply saying, I should have updated my terminology to a more timely phrase such as "Chinese person" or "Chinese-American" wouldn't have been so hard....I'm sure he was worried about bowing to the PC police...but I wouldn't see his admission of outdated terminology as anything of the sort
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Thu May 03, 2018 10:39 am

Zarniwoop wrote:I voted yes, as well....

My personal take -- I have no idea of Blankenship's background or his ideology. When he said "China Person" it reminded me of something folks from my grandparent's generation would say. For most of them that term wasn't racist...it was just awkward.

I have no idea if Blankenship deserves such leniency .... but it seems to me that him simply saying, I should have updated my terminology to a more timely phrase such as "Chinese person" or "Chinese-American" wouldn't have been so hard....I'm sure he was worried about bowing to the PC police...but I wouldn't see his admission of outdated terminology as anything of the sort

Don Blankenship was the CEO of Massey energy which at the time of his stewardship was the largest coal company in the state.

The company and Don himself were popular because pay for miners tends to be pretty good and as they say in WV, "Coal is King". Behind the scenes Massey was not exactly concerned with miner safety and it culminated in the Upper Big Branch mine disaster that killed 29 miners in 2010.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_Big_Branch_Mine_disaster

Don was convicted in 2015 for conspiring to violate mine safety standards and spent a year in prison. As you might imagine, I would not be one of his supporters if I still lived there and would be rooting for Manchin's primary challenger to win the seat since Manchin is a corporate Democrat who has rubbed elbows with Blankenship in the past when he was Governor.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby The Outsider » Thu May 03, 2018 4:53 pm

While I'm one of the first to decry the pussification of America, you can't just go around saying China person. Even if the intent isn't racially charged and the comment was just clumsy, it looks extremely racially charged regardless.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby NYBF » Thu May 03, 2018 7:49 pm

Anyone think for a minute maybe McConnell's father sells fancy dishes to couples getting married?
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Ken Carson » Thu May 03, 2018 7:52 pm

The Outsider wrote:While I'm one of the first to decry the pussification of America, you can't just go around saying China person. Even if the intent isn't racially charged and the comment was just clumsy, it looks extremely racially charged regardless.

The question asked was about whether doubling down on it was idiotic. So, even if you wanna want to not be PC and string the guy up for saying it... he didn’t walk it back when given the chance. Stupid.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby deltbucs » Thu May 03, 2018 8:52 pm

I voted no. I think it was pretty smart. WV is a state that Trump dominated in the primaries. Blankenship is obviously trying to use the same tactics that worked for Trump. Unapologetic borderline racism. Telling people that he's trying to stop Jyna from winning. Calling out the establishment. Saying someone with a non-European heritage can't be trusted. He did that all in one shot and isn't going to admit to doing anything wrong. That's Trump 101 **** and it got Trump like 80% of the vote in the primaries. If this guy had any sort of that Trump-like used car salesman charisma I'd put my money on him winning. Smart move by Blankenship, IMO.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Buc2 » Fri May 04, 2018 10:00 am

deltbucs wrote:I voted no. I think it was pretty smart. WV is a state that Trump dominated in the primaries. Blankenship is obviously trying to use the same tactics that worked for Trump. Unapologetic borderline racism. Telling people that he's trying to stop Jyna from winning. Calling out the establishment. Saying someone with a non-European heritage can't be trusted. He did that all in one shot and isn't going to admit to doing anything wrong. That's Trump 101 **** and it got Trump like 80% of the vote in the primaries. If this guy had any sort of that Trump-like used car salesman charisma I'd put my money on him winning. Smart move by Blankenship, IMO.

I hadn't looked at it like that. Good point, delt.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri May 04, 2018 10:02 am

When I created the topic I simply meant from surface level...not implications from potential voters
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Fri May 04, 2018 10:03 am

deltbucs wrote:I voted no. I think it was pretty smart. WV is a state that Trump dominated in the primaries. Blankenship is obviously trying to use the same tactics that worked for Trump. Unapologetic borderline racism. Telling people that he's trying to stop Jyna from winning. Calling out the establishment. Saying someone with a non-European heritage can't be trusted. He did that all in one shot and isn't going to admit to doing anything wrong. That's Trump 101 **** and it got Trump like 80% of the vote in the primaries. If this guy had any sort of that Trump-like used car salesman charisma I'd put my money on him winning. Smart move by Blankenship, IMO.

That's very true. I heard "He tells it like it is" a million times before the election. I doubt this affects Blankenship at all, but I wouldn't say his victory is inevitable.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Buc2 » Fri May 04, 2018 10:45 am

Zarniwoop wrote:When I created the topic I simply meant from surface level...not implications from potential voters

In that light, I will stick with my earlier pov.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri May 04, 2018 10:53 am

Buc2 wrote:
Zarniwoop wrote:When I created the topic I simply meant from surface level...not implications from potential voters

In that light, I will stick with my earlier pov.



I'll try to be more specific and narrow in my future descriptions...I meant this mainly from a social perspective

As I'm sure everyone knows here...I'm pretty anti-PC...but I do think this example is one that clearly the speaker can simply update to a more modern term without bowing the the PC crowd. To me it pretty much seems like updating language...not switching because it might offend someone. Like how gay used to mean happy, cheerful. If someone is still saying it in the old way, it isn't homophobic...simply archaic
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Buc2 » Fri May 04, 2018 12:00 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:
Buc2 wrote:In that light, I will stick with my earlier pov.



I'll try to be more specific and narrow in my future descriptions...I meant this mainly from a social perspective

As I'm sure everyone knows here...I'm pretty anti-PC...but I do think this example is one that clearly the speaker can simply update to a more modern term without bowing the the PC crowd. To me it pretty much seems like updating language...not switching because it might offend someone. Like how gay used to mean happy, cheerful. If someone is still saying it in the old way, it isn't homophobic...simply archaic

I can forgive the usage of outdated language. I have a harder time forgiving racially charged language which, imo, his use of "China man" was. Had he backtracked and explained he didn't mean it that way, I could move on. But, like you said, he doubled down. So my answer to the question remains, yes.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby beardmcdoug » Mon May 07, 2018 12:24 pm

my thoughts on him saying "he's a wealthy china man" - who cares? why should that offend anyone? everybody's so damn sensitive about everybody's race... I think it's helpful to flip the script and imagine it the other way around:

if I, a white "american", were living in china, with my dad, who happened to be a wealthy well-connected american businessman - and a chinese guy running for some political office in china said "yeah that beard mcdoug's dad is a wealthy America Man" - I wouldn't give two shits. Yes, he is an "America Man" - he is from America, made his money via his networking that he conducted in America, and if the insinuation is that he has America's best interests in mind, then he's probably right. It's like saying he's a "company man" - if I worked at home depot, then I am a "Home Depot man", or if I drive a Chevy proudly, then I am a "Chevy Man". Right now, in my life, I am both an "American" and an "America Man". If McConnell's dad isn't a "China man" - then let the poor sap defend himself and release a statement saying he's not. The public benefits from the spotlight being shown on this guy temporarily - maybe he IS a political actor that has some influence in helping steer China-first policies. Let the public decide. The more transparency, the more information, the better.

Now if the chinese guy called my dad a "fat, diabetes-having, scooter-riding dimwitted American", or if Blankenship called him a... well, let's not go there... but he didn't, so who cares
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Ken Carson » Mon May 07, 2018 2:26 pm

beardmcdoug wrote:my thoughts on him saying "he's a wealthy china man" - who cares? why should that offend anyone? everybody's so damn sensitive about everybody's race... I think it's helpful to flip the script and imagine it the other way around:

if I, a white "american", were living in china, with my dad, who happened to be a wealthy well-connected american businessman - and a chinese guy running for some political office in china said "yeah that beard mcdoug's dad is a wealthy America Man" - I wouldn't give two shits. Yes, he is an "America Man" - he is from America, made his money via his networking that he conducted in America, and if the insinuation is that he has America's best interests in mind, then he's probably right. It's like saying he's a "company man" - if I worked at home depot, then I am a "Home Depot man", or if I drive a Chevy proudly, then I am a "Chevy Man". Right now, in my life, I am both an "American" and an "America Man". If McConnell's dad isn't a "China man" - then let the poor sap defend himself and release a statement saying he's not. The public benefits from the spotlight being shown on this guy temporarily - maybe he IS a political actor that has some influence in helping steer China-first policies. Let the public decide. The more transparency, the more information, the better.

Now if the chinese guy called my dad a "fat, diabetes-having, scooter-riding dimwitted American", or if Blankenship called him a... well, let's not go there... but he didn't, so who cares

Maybe you don’t understand the fact that chinaman is a derogatory term. It is not the same as Englishman or Irishman, etc.

And many in here have said that sure, maybe someone misuses a term without bad intent. But he was given a chance to rephrase, and didn’t.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby beardmcdoug » Mon May 07, 2018 4:08 pm

why is china man derogatory?

is america man derogatory?
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Mon May 07, 2018 4:40 pm

The guy is leading in the polls.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Ken Carson » Mon May 07, 2018 5:22 pm

beardmcdoug wrote:why is china man derogatory?

is america man derogatory?

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/chinaman

The reason ‘chinaman’ is derogatory is because for the last 200 years, it as been used as an offensive term. As for your second question, it’s not.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby deltbucs » Mon May 07, 2018 6:47 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:The guy is leading in the polls.


Called it. Followed the Trump playbook and it worked in WV.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed May 09, 2018 7:17 am

He lost.
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Re: Can we agree? Episode 1

Postby Ken Carson » Wed May 09, 2018 9:21 am

Hope for WV yet.
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