Immigration question for the Progressives

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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Rocker » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:25 pm

Jonny wrote:
deltbucs wrote:Not complicated why we want to spend more money on immigration detention centers. Just a couple of the first Google results....


Company that runs immigration detention centers is top donor for two Texas congressmen
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politic ... ongressmen

Private prisons back Trump and could see big payoffs with new policies
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... /98300394/


This is no different from Unions donating to Democrats. Everyone is about self interest. I do not understand why every time someone discovers some form of political donation on part of a businessman, it is somehow a big deal and some form of corruption.


This is literally the definition of corrupt politics.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Jonny » Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:53 am

Rocker wrote:
Jonny wrote:
This is no different from Unions donating to Democrats. Everyone is about self interest. I do not understand why every time someone discovers some form of political donation on part of a businessman, it is somehow a big deal and some form of corruption.


This is literally the definition of corrupt politics.


You classify it as corrupt politics because you do not like the type of business that these donators are running. I loathe the unions, and big businesses that are helped by Government regulations. Their political donations to Democrats are just as selfish. The act of donating to politicians that are favorable isn't corruption in itself. The apparatus that grants the Government the powers to perform political favors is where the problem is.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby deltbucs » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:21 am

Jonny wrote:
deltbucs wrote:Not complicated why we want to spend more money on immigration detention centers. Just a couple of the first Google results....


Company that runs immigration detention centers is top donor for two Texas congressmen
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politic ... ongressmen

Private prisons back Trump and could see big payoffs with new policies
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... /98300394/


This is no different from Unions donating to Democrats. Everyone is about self interest. I do not understand why every time someone discovers some form of political donation on part of a businessman, it is somehow a big deal and some form of corruption.

This isn't about democrats or republicans

Last edited by deltbucs on Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Jason Bourne » Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:04 am

Keep in mind that ,In 1972,note a crack commando unit was sent to prison by a military court for a crime they didn't commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security stockade to the Los Angeles underground. Today, still wanted by the government, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire... the A-Team.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mightyleemoon » Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:20 am

Jonny wrote:
Rocker wrote:
This is literally the definition of corrupt politics.


You classify it as corrupt politics because you do not like the type of business that these donators are running. I loathe the unions, and big businesses that are helped by Government regulations. Their political donations to Democrats are just as selfish. The act of donating to politicians that are favorable isn't corruption in itself. The apparatus that grants the Government the powers to perform political favors is where the problem is.


I don't know about that guy, but I don't like any type of business donating to a politician. Ever.

That practice needs to stop.

When it comes to politics, things would be much better if there were just one pool that everyone were allowed to donate to. That pool would then be split evenly amongst those campaigning.

"Would you like to donate to the Political Pool?"

That money then goes towards everyone running.

Of course, that sort of thing would never fly because stupid ****ing reasons. But, it would be a step towards cutting some corruption.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 2:52 am

Corrupt politics and corrupt society go hand in hand. Getting back on track. What are the Pubs putting in immigration bills that the Dems cant support and why? I keep hearing nothing will get done because the sides are divided over political gain, the only thing I can think of gain wise for the Pubs is it turns out it was the right thing to do. What am I missing.

Who in here wants the border to stay like it is, which is basically wide open? What about our northern border? I'll be quick to admit I dont know how we operate up there. I do know if you got a felony your not getting into Canada.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby deltbucs » Mon Jun 25, 2018 7:09 am

The Trump administration rejects its own study finding refugees help the economy

The Trump administration rejected a study conducted by its own Department of Health and Human Services finding that refugees had a net positive value in the United States over the past decade, according to a recent report by the New York Times.

The study found that between 2005 and 2014, refugees “contributed an estimated $269.1 billion in revenues to all levels of government” through the payment of federal, state, and local taxes — which far outweighed their cost to the country. “Overall, this report estimated that the net fiscal impact of refugees was positive over the 10-year period, at $63 billion.” When the study was completed in July, however, it was never publicly released, and the Trump administration dismissed the findings.


https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... lp-economy

Old information, but seems pretty relevant to this conversation. Especially considering how the cost of us detaining refugees in sky rocketing.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby DreadNaught » Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:15 am

deltbucs wrote:The Trump administration rejects its own study finding refugees help the economy

The Trump administration rejected a study conducted by its own Department of Health and Human Services finding that refugees had a net positive value in the United States over the past decade, according to a recent report by the New York Times.

The study found that between 2005 and 2014, refugees “contributed an estimated $269.1 billion in revenues to all levels of government” through the payment of federal, state, and local taxes — which far outweighed their cost to the country. “Overall, this report estimated that the net fiscal impact of refugees was positive over the 10-year period, at $63 billion.” When the study was completed in July, however, it was never publicly released, and the Trump administration dismissed the findings.


https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... lp-economy

Old information, but seems pretty relevant to this conversation. Especially considering how the cost of us detaining refugees in sky rocketing.


Relevant how exactly? Is the argument that b/c refugees and/or undocumented/illegal immigrants have a statistical 'net positive' to the economy that we shouldn't have or enforce immigration laws? I'm not refuting the data, but just curious how that is relevant to those that believe it's ok to break immigration laws without consequence?

I'm all for figuring out an amnesty solution for the undocumented people here that are already here. But without border security and immigration laws that are enforced any such solution is useless as people will continue to willfully violate our sovereignty.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby deltbucs » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:20 am

DreadNaught wrote:
deltbucs wrote:The Trump administration rejects its own study finding refugees help the economy



https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... lp-economy

Old information, but seems pretty relevant to this conversation. Especially considering how the cost of us detaining refugees in sky rocketing.


Relevant how exactly? Is the argument that b/c refugees and/or undocumented/illegal immigrants have a statistical 'net positive' to the economy that we shouldn't have or enforce immigration laws? I'm not refuting the data, but just curious how that is relevant to those that believe it's ok to break immigration laws without consequence?

I'm all for figuring out an amnesty solution for the undocumented people here that are already here. But without border security and immigration laws that are enforced any such solution is useless as people will continue to willfully violate our sovereignty.

It's relevant because one of the points that people like to make about refugees is their drain on 'Merica and how they're costing tax payers. There is a lot of misinformation out there, so I wanted to present this. I'm sorry the connection wasn't clear for you.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Zarniwoop » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:25 am

Free movement of labor always benefits the receiving economy in terms of adding productivity (from an absolute sense) provided the social welfare programs aren’t crazy out of line.

For me personally this issue has next to nothing to about economic impact of people entering the country legally or illegally.

On several occasions I have voiced my opinion in increasing legal immigration.

To me this is about national sovereignty. That’s it. Period. I think it is like that for many people however they are too cowardly to admit it so they fall back onto economic arguments.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby DreadNaught » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:54 am

deltbucs wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:
Relevant how exactly? Is the argument that b/c refugees and/or undocumented/illegal immigrants have a statistical 'net positive' to the economy that we shouldn't have or enforce immigration laws? I'm not refuting the data, but just curious how that is relevant to those that believe it's ok to break immigration laws without consequence?

I'm all for figuring out an amnesty solution for the undocumented people here that are already here. But without border security and immigration laws that are enforced any such solution is useless as people will continue to willfully violate our sovereignty.

It's relevant because one of the points that people like to make about refugees is their drain on 'Merica and how they're costing tax payers. There is a lot of misinformation out there, so I wanted to present this. I'm sorry the connection wasn't clear for you.


Fair enough, I didn't see where that argument was being made here so it seemed like a moving the goalposts a bit. There are certainly other factors of illegal immigration beyond economic ones.

The fact is that America takes in around 1 million legal immigrants per year and has done so at that rate for about the last two decades. I'm open to discussions that we can increase that number or provide an amnesty path for those already here undocumented provided they've met certain conditions (working, not violent criminals, etc).

But those discussion are fruitless if sovereignty and boarder security are not addressed first. It's completely disingenuous to turn a blind eye to those that willfully violate our immigration laws while making an argument about their economic impact unless you're making a larger argument for open borders.

As a sovereign country we have the right to know who is entering and living in this country and thus govern that process via immigration laws that are enforced.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:40 am

What kind of stupid wants open borders so they can complain about hwy traffic?
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:00 am

mdb1958 wrote:What kind of stupid wants open borders so they can complain about hwy traffic?

This morning's New York Times
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/us/politics/fast-check-donald-trump-democrats-open-borders.html

Fact Check of the Day
No, Democrats Don’t Want ‘Open Borders’

President Trump has made this false claim at least two dozen times since taking office. Democrats support border security measures, though not the border wall he wants to build.
What was said
Trump Tweet
"The Democrats want open borders. They want anybody they wanted, including MS-13, pouring into the country.”

— President Trump, speaking on Monday at a campaign rally in South Carolina

He repeated the claim on Tuesday night as primary results were coming in.
Trump Tweet

the facts
False.
Democrats have argued that building a wall on the southwestern border is ineffective and a waste of resources, and rejected hard-line proposals to limit legal immigration. But Mr. Trump is grossly exaggerating Democrats’ positions when he conflates their opposition to his signature campaign promise and immigration priorities as “open borders.” And there is no evidence that they “want anybody,” including MS-13, to enter the United States freely.

While criticizing Mr. Trump’s immigration policies, the Democratic National Committee has committed to improving border security.

Senator Chuck Schumer of New York and Representative Nancy Pelosi of California, the Democratic leaders, have rebutted the president’s charges. Additionally, their aides cited several examples of legislation that are supported by Democrats and would have provided border security funding.
Schumer Tweet

Responding last week to Mr. Trump’s earlier claims, Ms. Pelosi said, “No, we do care about the border.”

“We care about protecting our country, but we don’t think we need to protect the border by putting children in cages,” Ms. Pelosi said. “We want to be smart and strong — not reckless, rash and ruthless in this case.”

Thirty Democrats in the House have sponsored a bipartisan immigration bill this year that gives the young undocumented immigrants known as Dreamers a pathway to citizenship. It also enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.

All 193 Democrats in the House and 23 moderate Republicans have signed a “discharge” petition to force a vote on that bill and other immigration proposals.

In the Senate, all but one Democrat voted for similar immigration legislation sponsored by Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware.

And all but three Democrats voted for yet another bipartisan proposal to provide a pathway to citizenship to Dreamers, authorize $25 billion to build barriers and hire personnel at the border over the next decade. It would also prohibit green-card holders from sponsoring adult children.

Sarah Huckabee Sanders, Mr. Trump’s press secretary, repeated the assertion on Monday and argued that Democrats have “made it very clear that they don’t want to work with the president, that they don’t want to fix our immigration system” — referring to the political impasse over immigration reform.

The vast majority of Senate Democrats, and 14 Republicans, voted down a White House-backed Senate proposal that would enable the Department of Homeland Security to make more arrests and deportations, limit family-based immigration, and eliminate the diversity visa lottery. House Democrats have also suggested opposition to a new measure that will also limit legal immigration.

But rejecting these proposals does not amount to opposing any enforcement of immigration laws or allowing anyone, including criminals and gang members, to enter the country without restrictions.

Democrats also consistently supported border security measures before Mr. Trump took office.

In 2013, every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the so-called Gang of Eight immigration overhaul bill that would have provided about $40 billion for border enforcement, including deploying thousands more agents and building 700 miles of fencing. (The House never voted on the bill.)

And in 2006, 26 Senate Democrats voted to build 700 miles of walls and fences on the southwestern border. Mr. Schumer was among the Democrats who supported that proposal — a fact that even Mr. Trump has repeatedly acknowledged, as recently as last week.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby RedLeader » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:07 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:What kind of stupid wants open borders so they can complain about hwy traffic?

This morning's New York Times
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/us/politics/fast-check-donald-trump-democrats-open-borders.html

Fact Check of the Day
No, Democrats Don’t Want ‘Open Borders’

President Trump has made this false claim at least two dozen times since taking office. Democrats support border security measures, though not the border wall he wants to build.
What was said
Trump Tweet
"The Democrats want open borders. They want anybody they wanted, including MS-13, pouring into the country.”

— President Trump, speaking on Monday at a campaign rally in South Carolina

He repeated the claim on Tuesday night as primary results were coming in.
Trump Tweet

the facts
False.
Democrats have argued that building a wall on the southwestern border is ineffective and a waste of resources, and rejected hard-line proposals to limit legal immigration. But Mr. Trump is grossly exaggerating Democrats’ positions when he conflates their opposition to his signature campaign promise and immigration priorities as “open borders.” And there is no evidence that they “want anybody,” including MS-13, to enter the United States freely.

While criticizing Mr. Trump’s immigration policies, the Democratic National Committee has committed to improving border security.

Senator Chuck Schumer of New York and Representative Nancy Pelosi of California, the Democratic leaders, have rebutted the president’s charges. Additionally, their aides cited several examples of legislation that are supported by Democrats and would have provided border security funding.
Schumer Tweet

Responding last week to Mr. Trump’s earlier claims, Ms. Pelosi said, “No, we do care about the border.”

“We care about protecting our country, but we don’t think we need to protect the border by putting children in cages,” Ms. Pelosi said. “We want to be smart and strong — not reckless, rash and ruthless in this case.”

Thirty Democrats in the House have sponsored a bipartisan immigration bill this year that gives the young undocumented immigrants known as Dreamers a pathway to citizenship. It also enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.

All 193 Democrats in the House and 23 moderate Republicans have signed a “discharge” petition to force a vote on that bill and other immigration proposals.

In the Senate, all but one Democrat voted for similar immigration legislation sponsored by Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware.

And all but three Democrats voted for yet another bipartisan proposal to provide a pathway to citizenship to Dreamers, authorize $25 billion to build barriers and hire personnel at the border over the next decade. It would also prohibit green-card holders from sponsoring adult children.

Sarah Huckabee Sanders, Mr. Trump’s press secretary, repeated the assertion on Monday and argued that Democrats have “made it very clear that they don’t want to work with the president, that they don’t want to fix our immigration system” — referring to the political impasse over immigration reform.

The vast majority of Senate Democrats, and 14 Republicans, voted down a White House-backed Senate proposal that would enable the Department of Homeland Security to make more arrests and deportations, limit family-based immigration, and eliminate the diversity visa lottery. House Democrats have also suggested opposition to a new measure that will also limit legal immigration.

But rejecting these proposals does not amount to opposing any enforcement of immigration laws or allowing anyone, including criminals and gang members, to enter the country without restrictions.

Democrats also consistently supported border security measures before Mr. Trump took office.

In 2013, every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the so-called Gang of Eight immigration overhaul bill that would have provided about $40 billion for border enforcement, including deploying thousands more agents and building 700 miles of fencing. (The House never voted on the bill.)

And in 2006, 26 Senate Democrats voted to build 700 miles of walls and fences on the southwestern border. Mr. Schumer was among the Democrats who supported that proposal — a fact that even Mr. Trump has repeatedly acknowledged, as recently as last week.


I’ll take ‘Sanctuary Cities’ for a thousand, Alex...
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Ken Carson » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:20 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:What kind of stupid wants open borders so they can complain about hwy traffic?

This morning's New York Times
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/us/politics/fast-check-donald-trump-democrats-open-borders.html

Fact Check of the Day
No, Democrats Don’t Want ‘Open Borders’

President Trump has made this false claim at least two dozen times since taking office. Democrats support border security measures, though not the border wall he wants to build.
What was said
Trump Tweet
"The Democrats want open borders. They want anybody they wanted, including MS-13, pouring into the country.”

— President Trump, speaking on Monday at a campaign rally in South Carolina

He repeated the claim on Tuesday night as primary results were coming in.
Trump Tweet

the facts
False.
Democrats have argued that building a wall on the southwestern border is ineffective and a waste of resources, and rejected hard-line proposals to limit legal immigration. But Mr. Trump is grossly exaggerating Democrats’ positions when he conflates their opposition to his signature campaign promise and immigration priorities as “open borders.” And there is no evidence that they “want anybody,” including MS-13, to enter the United States freely.

While criticizing Mr. Trump’s immigration policies, the Democratic National Committee has committed to improving border security.

Senator Chuck Schumer of New York and Representative Nancy Pelosi of California, the Democratic leaders, have rebutted the president’s charges. Additionally, their aides cited several examples of legislation that are supported by Democrats and would have provided border security funding.
Schumer Tweet

Responding last week to Mr. Trump’s earlier claims, Ms. Pelosi said, “No, we do care about the border.”

“We care about protecting our country, but we don’t think we need to protect the border by putting children in cages,” Ms. Pelosi said. “We want to be smart and strong — not reckless, rash and ruthless in this case.”

Thirty Democrats in the House have sponsored a bipartisan immigration bill this year that gives the young undocumented immigrants known as Dreamers a pathway to citizenship. It also enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.

All 193 Democrats in the House and 23 moderate Republicans have signed a “discharge” petition to force a vote on that bill and other immigration proposals.

In the Senate, all but one Democrat voted for similar immigration legislation sponsored by Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware.

And all but three Democrats voted for yet another bipartisan proposal to provide a pathway to citizenship to Dreamers, authorize $25 billion to build barriers and hire personnel at the border over the next decade. It would also prohibit green-card holders from sponsoring adult children.

Sarah Huckabee Sanders, Mr. Trump’s press secretary, repeated the assertion on Monday and argued that Democrats have “made it very clear that they don’t want to work with the president, that they don’t want to fix our immigration system” — referring to the political impasse over immigration reform.

The vast majority of Senate Democrats, and 14 Republicans, voted down a White House-backed Senate proposal that would enable the Department of Homeland Security to make more arrests and deportations, limit family-based immigration, and eliminate the diversity visa lottery. House Democrats have also suggested opposition to a new measure that will also limit legal immigration.

But rejecting these proposals does not amount to opposing any enforcement of immigration laws or allowing anyone, including criminals and gang members, to enter the country without restrictions.

Democrats also consistently supported border security measures before Mr. Trump took office.

In 2013, every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the so-called Gang of Eight immigration overhaul bill that would have provided about $40 billion for border enforcement, including deploying thousands more agents and building 700 miles of fencing. (The House never voted on the bill.)

And in 2006, 26 Senate Democrats voted to build 700 miles of walls and fences on the southwestern border. Mr. Schumer was among the Democrats who supported that proposal — a fact that even Mr. Trump has repeatedly acknowledged, as recently as last week.


I think the 'waste of resources' is a great case against this moronic wall idea. It plays a lot better than calling anyone who considers the idea might be a good idea a racist, don't you agree?

Trump's insistence on a wall at the cost of other good improvements on the issue, like the ones outlined in the article, is exactly what we should be focusing on. Not whether he is a terrible person for calling people 'animals,' and that anyone who supports the idea of a wall as a 'deplorable.'

Funny how the terms 'animal' and 'deplorable' are dehumanizing to large groups of people, yet it appears that only one of those is offensive to each team. Well, it's not funny. But you get what I mean.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:37 am

Hotel America --------------------------------- all full!

Check back next week.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:53 am

What MB's post says to me

everybody here the wrong way --- gets to stay. ((( I'm willing to work hard on this one )))

anybody here in the future --- gets to stay.

keep the coke --- still flowing

most important of all --- can change by who is in charge.

I think they (Dems) would be fine with say a half million a year. I'm sorry but I dont agree, our population is going to grow enough without all that.

The same nut jobs that support this - do this - and then complain that its not fair to be poor in America.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby NYBF » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:10 am

Good thing they got this tax paying social security number having hard working guy the **** out of my country!



An Albanian immigrant who worked as a waiter at a Long Island diner for 24 years — and always filed his taxes — said immigration agents shackled him two months ago, threw him in jail for two days and then put him on a plane back to his native country.

Sokol Vokshi, 47, said he wasn’t even allowed to call his wife or two kids at their home in Elmont during the ordeal.

“I didn’t know what hit me,” Vokshi, now stranded in Durrës, Albania, told The Post Monday.

His immigration lawyer, Altin Nanaj, said the deportation was highly unusual because Vokshi had been issued a Social Security number, given annual work permits, paid his taxes every year, and has no criminal record.

“This is a model family man who worked day and night,” said Nanaj.

“ICE is after everybody.”

Jimmy Trahanas, the owner of the Golden Reef Diner in Rockville Centre, said he didn’t know what to make of it when Vokshi – known as “Sal” – suddenly didn’t show up for work.

“The customers were upset,” he said. “Everybody was asking for him.”

A poster that hangs in the window shows two photos of “Sal” and publicizes a GoFundMe campaign created by customers to help defray his legal fees and other expenses.

So far, more than $11,600 from 168 people has been raised for the “Get Sal Back to the USA” fund started by customer Warren Prosky on April 22.

“Sal came to the US 24 years ago and has worked at the Golden Reef diner for those 24 years. He married a woman from Albania, and they have two children, ages 12 and 14,” reads the fund blurb.

“Sal owns his house in Elmont, NY and has been trying to become an American for years.”

Vokshi said he was a young political asylum seeker when he made it to New York in 1993.

He registered with the federal government and was given a Social Security number. When immigration judges denied his application to live in the US in 1997 and asked him to leave, he said a series of lawyers he hired told him to stay put and appeal.

“They told me, ‘Stay, during your appeal. Keep working, keep at it,’” he recalled.

“One thing led to another, I stayed, I worked, I got married, I had kids.”

Vokshi said he was sent a letter by ICE asking him to appear at a meeting with it at 26 Federal Plaza on April 3.

He said he thought it would be another routine meeting discussing his appeal.

But once in the office, Vokshi said agents tossed out his lawyer out and slapped on the cuffs.

Three days later, he was on a plane back to Albania, where his sister still lives.

“I don’t recognize this place,” he said.

Vokshi said he is still paying $12,000 in annual real estate taxes on his Long Island home and has been trying to find work in Albania.

“I go to the restaurants and the bars, but they don’t hire me,” he said.

“They think I’m old.”

He said if he can’t get a visa to get back to the United States, his wife and American-born daughter will join him in Albania.

“We can’t be separated like this,” he said.

“Our American dream is turning into a nightmare.”
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Jason Bourne » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:15 am

that is fucked up ^^^
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Brazen331 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:21 am

These immigration protests remind me of something that happened during the Reagan administration. I was a kid at the time so I dont know the specifics of who was responsible, but ketchup was categorized as a vegetable in a school lunch guideline or something or other, and Liberals went batshit crazy.

You had hordes of protesters banging lunch trays with forks and knives so the world would know how cruel Reagan was to the children, similar to what’s happening now but without the utensils.

Makes me think these protests today have as much to do with immigrant children as those protests back then had to do with healthy lunches. If someone in the Carter administration did the ketchup thing, would we have even known back then? There certainly would have been no protests for the media to cover.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby NYBF » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:03 pm

Holy ****, you were a kid when Reagan was president? I figured you to be some dipshit kid.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby deltbucs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 10:55 am

I assumed he was like college-aged.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:12 am

deltbucs wrote:I assumed he was like college-aged.

Should we tell him about the time Reagan granted amnesty to 3 million illegal immigrants in 1986?
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:37 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
deltbucs wrote:I assumed he was like college-aged.

Should we tell him about the time Reagan granted amnesty to 3 million illegal immigrants in 1986?



Steve King says Ronald Reagan’s 1986 "amnesty act" led to 15 million votes for Barack Obama
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:59 am

mdb1958 wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Should we tell him about the time Reagan granted amnesty to 3 million illegal immigrants in 1986?



Steve King says Ronald Reagan’s 1986 "amnesty act" led to 15 million votes for Barack Obama

Steve King is an idiot.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby The Outsider » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:39 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:

Steve King says Ronald Reagan’s 1986 "amnesty act" led to 15 million votes for Barack Obama

Steve King is an idiot.


Even if he was right, so what? Reagan granted immigrants amnesty and their kids grew up and made a decision about who to vote for. Is that suddenly an awful thing that citizens can have opinions about who they would like as president and can then vote in line with said opinion?

I don't blame past government for letting Cuban refugees in to the country back in the 60s even though Cubans as a voting block largely hold opinions on policy that I disagree with.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:48 pm

The Outsider wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Steve King is an idiot.


Even if he was right, so what? Reagan granted immigrants amnesty and their kids grew up and made a decision about who to vote for. Is that suddenly an awful thing that citizens can have opinions about who they would like as president and can then vote in line with said opinion?

I don't blame past government for letting Cuban refugees in to the country back in the 60s even though Cubans as a voting block largely hold opinions on policy that I disagree with.

Indeed. But the problem with King's assertion is that resident aliens have voting rights. They haven't since 1928 from various state laws an have been barred from voting in federal elections since 1996. Rightfully so, I might add.

That and politifact said his numbers weren't even close.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby The Outsider » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:52 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
The Outsider wrote:
Even if he was right, so what? Reagan granted immigrants amnesty and their kids grew up and made a decision about who to vote for. Is that suddenly an awful thing that citizens can have opinions about who they would like as president and can then vote in line with said opinion?

I don't blame past government for letting Cuban refugees in to the country back in the 60s even though Cubans as a voting block largely hold opinions on policy that I disagree with.

Indeed. But the problem with King's assertion is that resident aliens have voting rights. They haven't since 1928 from various state laws an have been barred from voting in federal elections since 1996. Rightfully so, I might add.

That and politifact said his numbers weren't even close.


1986 was 22 years before Obama's first term. If that's the case the guy is attempting to make he's even dumber than I thought. First off, a ton of those resident aliens more than likely became citizens, and even if they did not any of their kids born in the country would be citizens so the point is mostly invalid regardless of the technicalities.
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:09 pm

Sucking the Dems ass has never turned out well for the Pubs. How many years before the party name change?
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Re: Immigration question for the Progressives

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:37 pm

mdb1958 wrote:Sucking the Dems ass has never turned out well for the Pubs. How many years before the party name change?

As a registered Democrat I am here to tell the world that has never happened to me, but Republicans can start sucking my ass whenever they're ready.
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