Random Political News

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Re: Random Political News

Postby NYBF » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:20 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:
NYBF wrote:
Left leaning twitter allows jackass who urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids who were killed to the point where they're unable to visit their child's graves to keep on tweeting: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-45107687

Good.


Thoughts on this tweet?

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(hint: that user was suspended - https://www.dailydot.com/unclick/twitte ... -t-nelson/ )
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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:26 pm

NYBF wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:Good.


Thoughts on this tweet?

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(hint: that user was suspended - https://www.dailydot.com/unclick/twitte ... -t-nelson/ )

I think it sounds pretty crazy.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:26 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Outside of competition and innovation and wealth which you just described, what are the other ideals about America that you love and serve as the justification of why others around the world want to live here?

You say "socialism" is antithetical to these things, but perhaps the discussion would be better served if we clarify what those things are.


Opportunity, individual liberty, individual self-determination. These are ideals that are not synonymous with Socialism past or present.

Okay, let's break this down a bit.

Opportunity: Opportunity to do what?

Individual Liberty: Liberty to do what?

Individual self-determination: Is this with or without limits?
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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:33 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:
Opportunity, individual liberty, individual self-determination. These are ideals that are not synonymous with Socialism past or present.

Okay, let's break this down a bit.

Opportunity: Opportunity to do what?

Individual Liberty: Liberty to do what?

Individual self-determination: Is this with or without limits?


I feel like people always ignore your Q&A setup.

Sorry, MB.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:37 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Okay, let's break this down a bit.

Opportunity: Opportunity to do what?

Individual Liberty: Liberty to do what?

Individual self-determination: Is this with or without limits?


I feel like people always ignore your Q&A setup.

Sorry, MB.

Well, one thing Dread and I have in common is that we're both capitalists and what he's saying here isn't outrageous or radical, but when we can't get terminology right, we have to come to a basic understanding of what we're talking about.

to do otherwise is to simply throw nonsensical partisan attacks at each other. And that's gotten quite boring.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby DreadNaught » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:16 pm

NYBF wrote:
Stuart wrote:let em all censor. FB and twitter are left leaning playgrounds.


Left leaning twitter allows jackass who urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids who were killed to the point where they're unable to visit their child's graves to keep on tweeting: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-45107687


I've seen alot of this talking point where Alex Jones is harassing Sandy Hook families, or like you posted encouraging his followers to do so.

This is from the article you posted.
Although Alex Jones has not been involved in the harassment of the families, Paradis says the president could use his influence to push Jones and the conspiracy theorists to the fringes, and help stop the harassment of Sandy Hook victims.


Where does Jones specifically "urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids"?

Ima kinda torn on this Infowars/censorship saga. I certainly don't like it for more reasons that I'd support it. Platforms like YT have monopolized video sharing so if they start to censor arbitrarily they leave themselves open to government regulation, which I don't like either.

I think twitter has it right on this issue. Establish a ToS and if users violate them they are punished iaw those ToS. That should be applied equally to all users (regardless of follower count or political leanings) by all social platforms imo.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby NYBF » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:26 pm

DreadNaught wrote:Where does Jones specifically "urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids"?

...

I think twitter has it right on this issue. Establish a ToS and if users violate them they are punished iaw those ToS. That should be applied equally to all users (regardless of follower count or political leanings) by all social platforms imo.


The guy is a piece of ****, I don't listen to him and can't give specifics, but what other reason would you have for trying to make the addresses of the parents public?

As far as your second line I quoted, do you agree with the suspension of the "antifa suspersoldier"?
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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:34 pm

NYBF wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:Where does Jones specifically "urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids"?

...

I think twitter has it right on this issue. Establish a ToS and if users violate them they are punished iaw those ToS. That should be applied equally to all users (regardless of follower count or political leanings) by all social platforms imo.


The guy is a piece of ****, I don't listen to him and can't give specifics, but what other reason would you have for trying to make the addresses of the parents public?

As far as your second line I quoted, do you agree with the suspension of the "antifa suspersoldier"?

He is a POS, but according to their TOS, he hasn't done anything worthy of being suspended.

The ANTIFA post you posted, the individual clearly calls for direct violence.

It seems you weren't following yesterday, but I'm not a fan of Jones and I support YT censoring their content as a company, but I don't agree with their seemingly limited scope in censoring. My, "Good" was because Twitter is putting a statement out there and they are promising to stand by it and not have people randomly banned like Candace Owens was. Twitter is stating they aren't banning people because they don't like their views or if they are a POS, but the individual needs to violate their set ToS first.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby NYBF » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:39 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:The ANTIFA post you posted, the individual clearly calls for direct violence.



You think that's a call for violence?
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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:42 pm

Yes.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby NYBF » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:44 pm

Explains why the bots are so successful.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:46 pm

I'm sure Nov 4th will still be successful for you.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby NYBF » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:49 pm

It was.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby DreadNaught » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:01 pm

NYBF wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:Where does Jones specifically "urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids"?

...

I think twitter has it right on this issue. Establish a ToS and if users violate them they are punished iaw those ToS. That should be applied equally to all users (regardless of follower count or political leanings) by all social platforms imo.


The guy is a piece of ****, I don't listen to him and can't give specifics, but what other reason would you have for trying to make the addresses of the parents public?

As far as your second line I quoted, do you agree with the suspension of the "antifa suspersoldier"?


So according to that link it was his lawyer that made the heinous suggestion during litigation with lawyers for the plaintiff (representing the Sandy Hook family). That is obviously a distasteful tactic, but I figured there would type of video or post from Jones where he was "urging his followers to harass grieving parents" rather than parsing something his lawyer said. Maybe there is something else out there b/c I've seen this talking point a few times now but haven't found the source/citation where Jones did that.

In regards to your other question, I'd say it could be construed as inciting violence which probably violated the ToS. Like I stated, I support these platforms establishing and enforcing their ToS to all users equally which is why I think twitter got it right for the most part. It's up to users to understand the ToS and abide by them.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby beardmcdoug » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:10 pm

NYBF wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:Where does Jones specifically "urges his followers to harass grieving parents of kids"?

...

I think twitter has it right on this issue. Establish a ToS and if users violate them they are punished iaw those ToS. That should be applied equally to all users (regardless of follower count or political leanings) by all social platforms imo.


The guy is a piece of ****, I don't listen to him and can't give specifics, but what other reason would you have for trying to make the addresses of the parents public?

As far as your second line I quoted, do you agree with the suspension of the "antifa suspersoldier"?


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Re: Random Political News

Postby uscbucsfan » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:14 pm

Alex Jones is one of my least favorite people on Earth. After flat earthers and dino deniers 9/11 truthers are my least favorite group.

Edit: pedophilia is a sexual orientation folks are there, too. I'm sure there are more.
Last edited by uscbucsfan on Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby beardmcdoug » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:15 pm

just gonna go on the record (given that this is a satirical online account and in no way reflects my real beliefs) and say that, for as many "socialist" policies I think we should adopt regarding healthcare, the environment, banking regulations, political donations, etc --- I think there should be absolutely zero censorship of any kind whatsoever, hate speech included
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Brazen331 » Wed Aug 08, 2018 9:07 pm

"See it's like the middle-upper class doesn't exist anymore. It like had its like heydey in the 90's when you had like soccer moms with like 2 minivans but that is not like America anymore."

I'm paraphrasing but this is like how the actual new star of the Democrat party actually like speaks.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 9:11 pm

Brazen331 wrote:"See it's like the middle-upper class doesn't exist anymore. It like had its like heydey in the 90's when you had like soccer moms with like 2 minivans but that is not like America anymore."

I'm paraphrasing but this is like how the actual new star of the Democrat party actually like speaks.

Pretty cool, huh?
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Brazen331 » Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:50 pm

I think so. “If like 50 percent of the population like worked 2 jobs, then we would have like 100 percent employment.”
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:25 pm

Brazen331 wrote:I think so. “If like 50 percent of the population like worked 2 jobs, then we would have like 100 percent employment.”

Totally.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby MJW » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:28 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
Brazen331 wrote:"See it's like the middle-upper class doesn't exist anymore. It like had its like heydey in the 90's when you had like soccer moms with like 2 minivans but that is not like America anymore."

I'm paraphrasing but this is like how the actual new star of the Democrat party actually like speaks.

Pretty cool, huh?


I'm fairly sure this is actually code for, "Lawmakers shouldn't concern themselves with white middle class types anymore." I'm honestly surprised she had the intellectual restraint not to throw "white" into that sentence.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:34 pm

MJW wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Pretty cool, huh?


I'm fairly sure this is actually code for, "Lawmakers shouldn't concern themselves with white middle class types anymore." I'm honestly surprised she had the intellectual restraint not to throw "white" into that sentence.

You have her mistaken for Maxine Waters.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby MJW » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:38 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
MJW wrote:
I'm fairly sure this is actually code for, "Lawmakers shouldn't concern themselves with white middle class types anymore." I'm honestly surprised she had the intellectual restraint not to throw "white" into that sentence.

You have her mistaken for Maxine Waters.


Hey, throw in 80 and 90 years in DC...

Respectfully, MB, I don't begrudge you your desire to annoint a champion for alternative political representation in government. I share it, though in different ways. I just don't think this young lady is the droid you're looking for. She's really, really dumb. Every interview, no matter how soft the tosses, she sounds like Dubya trying to win Ben Stein's money. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. An articulate socialist can actually make the philosophy sound reasonable to some people. I'm perfectly happy with this living Tumblr account trying and failing to do it. But if I were you, I'd cast my die elsewhere.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:45 pm

MJW wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:You have her mistaken for Maxine Waters.


Hey, throw in 80 and 90 years in DC...

Respectfully, MB, I don't begrudge you your desire to annoint a champion for alternative political representation in government. I share it, though in different ways. I just don't think this young lady is the droid you're looking for. She's really, really dumb. Every interview, no matter how soft the tosses, she sounds like Dubya trying to win Ben Stein's money. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. An articulate socialist can actually make the philosophy sound reasonable to some people. I'm perfectly happy with this living Tumblr account trying and failing to do it. But if I were you, I'd cast my die elsewhere.

You nailed it.

I already know that policywonks like us are gonna be unmoved by her young kid diction, but the fact remains that you are putting too much stock in the American voter who thinks a guy like George Will is stuffy, boring, old guy while Donald Trump "tells it like it is."


The right is overrun with mouthbreathers. Tend your own garden.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Rocker » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:47 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
MJW wrote:
Hey, throw in 80 and 90 years in DC...

Respectfully, MB, I don't begrudge you your desire to annoint a champion for alternative political representation in government. I share it, though in different ways. I just don't think this young lady is the droid you're looking for. She's really, really dumb. Every interview, no matter how soft the tosses, she sounds like Dubya trying to win Ben Stein's money. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. An articulate socialist can actually make the philosophy sound reasonable to some people. I'm perfectly happy with this living Tumblr account trying and failing to do it. But if I were you, I'd cast my die elsewhere.

You nailed it.

I already know that policywonks like us are gonna be unmoved by her young kid diction, but the fact remains that you are putting too much stock in the American voter who thinks a guy like George Will is stuffy, boring, old guy while Donald Trump "tells it like it is."


The right is overrun with mouthbreathers. Tend your own garden.


Placeholder for rebuttal when I haven’t had too many adult beverages.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:51 pm

Rocker wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:You nailed it.

I already know that policywonks like us are gonna be unmoved by her young kid diction, but the fact remains that you are putting too much stock in the American voter who thinks a guy like George Will is stuffy, boring, old guy while Donald Trump "tells it like it is."


The right is overrun with mouthbreathers. Tend your own garden.


Placeholder for rebuttal when I haven’t had too many adult beverages.

She's our Joe the plumber...except that she won.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Brazen331 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:29 am

Joe the Plumber? She is your Sarah Palin. And how many soccer moms have 2 vans anyway? I thought the point in buying a van was that you don’t have to buy another one.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby MJW » Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:41 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
MJW wrote:
Hey, throw in 80 and 90 years in DC...

Respectfully, MB, I don't begrudge you your desire to annoint a champion for alternative political representation in government. I share it, though in different ways. I just don't think this young lady is the droid you're looking for. She's really, really dumb. Every interview, no matter how soft the tosses, she sounds like Dubya trying to win Ben Stein's money. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. An articulate socialist can actually make the philosophy sound reasonable to some people. I'm perfectly happy with this living Tumblr account trying and failing to do it. But if I were you, I'd cast my die elsewhere.

You nailed it.

I already know that policywonks like us are gonna be unmoved by her young kid diction, but the fact remains that you are putting too much stock in the American voter who thinks a guy like George Will is stuffy, boring, old guy while Donald Trump "tells it like it is."


The right is overrun with mouthbreathers. Tend your own garden.


Well, as you know I'm not of the right, at least not anymore. The closest thing I have to representation in Washington is Rand Paul, and I disagree with him about 40% of the time. But I understand your point. I wouldn't take this piece of advise from a Trump supporter. But you can take it from someone who wants less dumb in politics.
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Re: Random Political News

Postby Swashy » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:11 am

DreadNaught wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Outside of competition and innovation and wealth which you just described, what are the other ideals about America that you love and serve as the justification of why others around the world want to live here?

You say "socialism" is antithetical to these things, but perhaps the discussion would be better served if we clarify what those things are.


Opportunity, individual liberty, individual self-determination. These are ideals that are not synonymous with Socialism past or present.


Those attributes are not exactly synonymous with modern day capitalism either. Your individual self determination is basically worthless because work for the man at whatever dead end job you can find because your degree that you're $65,000 in debt for is watered down due to a 1,000 other people like you already having one. Meanwhile you're stuck debating on Buczone whether or not that unemployed person is at fault for taking a job that is under paying them and should've held out for something better. What kind of opportunity is that for the worker? Do we just say "ahh you ungrateful swine be happy you have anything at all!!!"?

Capitalism is on life support boys. Whatever manifestation people think it has taken on these days is not the same relationship we saw in the American economy of 60 years ago. The only part of the definition today's capitalism lives up to is that it is business for the profits of individuals and not the state. My grandfather raised 5 children over roughly 25 years on his union trucker salary in Pontiac Michigan delivering GM cars around America from the plant and a night time security job in Tampa while my grandmother stayed home. Now in some places it takes 2 salaries to even raise a single child and in 25 years my grandfather's job may no longer exist anymore because cars will drive themselves and more security features will be developed to where we no longer need people. What the actual **** did the American worker do wrong over that period of time to deserve such a fate? This business worship crap needs to stop. They're screwing us and we're smiling while they do it.

Each case is specific. Each case is different. Not everything is fucked for everyone. But it's happened often enough that it's beginning to lead to generational disenfranchisement and the ideas of socialism is taking root. Our children know better, they're the most educated group in history. But if the current trend continues for about another 10 to 20 years it's gonna get to the point where we can't blame them anymore for wanting gravitate to something so different when all they have to do is look towards their European cohorts who pay $200 a year for university like Cheb's sister-in-law or nieces, nephews (whatever it was) in Germany while Americans continue to try and fail the old fashioned way.
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