Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Rant)

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Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Rant)

Postby MJW » Fri Sep 28, 2018 1:02 am

I've been giving this some thought.

Your school has a QB battle between two top recruits.

One guy wins, one guy loses.

The loser immediately declares he's transferring to somewhere where he'll play.

Which statement best describes your response?

A) He made a commitment, and he's dishonoring that commitment. And this venerable program. Something something something, brotherhood. Something Something Something, Tradition. ETC.
B) I don't really hold it against him, but if he's the kind of kid who gives up that easy, I don't want him here anyway. Good riddance.
C) I don't blame him for looking out for himself. He's trying to build an NFL resume and he can't do that on a bench.
D) Other?

Been talking to hardcore Clemson fans about Kelly Bryant. I was considering playing it down the middle in the OP, but I have to be honest: I think some fans are completely full of ****. This kid is looking out for his future. Honor and commitment and blah blah blah, except here's the thing - if he spends the next few years rotting on the bench, it's not like Clemson's booster club is going to write him a "Great Team Guy" check he can live on when he doesn't get any NFL consideration.

Also, most of the people blathering about disrespecting the team and the brotherhood...If they got demoted at work, and another company offered to give them a very important position where they could build their resumes...bullshit they'd say, "Oh, no, I'm loyal to my work team that just informed me they don't believe in me, so forget your better offer!" No they wouldn't. They'd take the better offer because they're not insane.

People are self-interested, and for the most part, we get that, except as sports fans. As sports fans we expect "our" athletes to be loyal to the organizations and ideals that define us for three hours of recreational time on Saturday. Monday through Friday, we're taking the best deal, looking to make the most money, looking for the best opportunity, etc. But God Forbid a guy who plays football for our amusement tries to do the same.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby uscbucsfan » Fri Sep 28, 2018 6:01 am

The answer should be C.

A lot of Clemson fans are upset about his comments more than him transferring. He stated he never received a fair shot, even though Lawrence has looked better in practice, spring game, and when he came into the game. Dabo stuck with Bryant because he waited his turn, he's been there for a while, he was a good leader, etc. It came to a point where the Clemson offense just slowed to a crawl with Bryant and TL would come in and instantly score and spark to the point where he had to start.

Of course some fans are idiots and say he's been given a scholarship and he needs to be a back up, but every fan has idiots in their fan base and they are usually the most vocal. Bryant waited for Watson to leave and then went 16-2 (or something like that).

He could start for a lot of decent programs out there and while I don't think he has an NFL career ahead of him, he believes he does, and he won't see that from sitting on the bench at Clemson.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby MJW » Fri Sep 28, 2018 6:29 am

uscbucsfan wrote:The answer should be C.

A lot of Clemson fans are upset about his comments more than him transferring. He stated he never received a fair shot, even though Lawrence has looked better in practice, spring game, and when he came into the game. Dabo stuck with Bryant because he waited his turn, he's been there for a while, he was a good leader, etc. It came to a point where the Clemson offense just slowed to a crawl with Bryant and TL would come in and instantly score and spark to the point where he had to start.

Of course some fans are idiots and say he's been given a scholarship and he needs to be a back up, but every fan has idiots in their fan base and they are usually the most vocal. Bryant waited for Watson to leave and then went 16-2 (or something like that).

He could start for a lot of decent programs out there and while I don't think he has an NFL career ahead of him, he believes he does, and he won't see that from sitting on the bench at Clemson.


Completely reasonable, thank you. And no...the odds are pretty good a guy who loses a QB competition doesn't have a long NFL career ahead of him (though there are a few exceptions, like Joe Flacco.) But somewhere else, he can showcase himself, get drafted late, get a nice little signing bonus, etc. Probably not happening as a backup.

I just find this mentality from college football fans especially to be ridiculous. We act like these kids owe us something as fans, and they should make their life choices based on how much *we* love the teams they play for.

As for the scholarship argument, unless I'm mistaken, teams pull scholarship offer, greyshirt, oversign all the time. And coaches make all kinds of promises during recruiting about how they'll stick around all four years. It's a really weak argument for why someone should be scorned for finding a better situation with their life.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Fri Sep 28, 2018 6:39 am

Will Grier immediately sprung to mind, but that was different.

Same with his WR David Sills but he switched positions.

I'll find an example that works eventually. Thinking its more common than we think.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri Sep 28, 2018 6:47 am

I always think a kid should do what is best for them, only imbeciles don’t
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Native Son » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:01 am

Troy Aikman?
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Kress » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:20 am

I think the work comparison is a good one. Fans for the most part don't get it because we are school/logo oriented. We think that players should stick with teams out of loyalty just as fans do. That's just not reality for the players. They are the employees, and if they get a better job offer somewhere else, they are going to consider it just as any of us would in our working lives. Loyalty plays a part if things are pretty much equal, but in this context starting for someone like Auburn versus being a Clemson backup is a no brainer.

But overall, what usc said. I think a lot of fans are more upset with his "never given a chance" comments and attitude. For weeks, everyone I've talked to about it has been wondering why he was STILL being trotted out there to start and then sub back in throughout the game. Lawrence is obviously better, yet Bryant kept coming back. If anything, Dabo was loyal to Bryant by giving him shot after shot that he probably no longer warranted, and he turned around and shat on the organization for doing so. That's the issue, if you ask me.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Super K » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:38 am

You guys/gals are right on.

The other piece that pisses me off is the "coach speak". They interviewed Dabo, prior to Bryant making his decision, and when asked his thoughts on Bryant staying/leaving he said "I hope he does (stay)...we need him and we are gonna need him this season."

Then maybe you shouldn't have benched your Senior QB, whom lead you back to the playoffs last year and was undefeated this year, for your shiny new freshman toy.

And guess what?...he'll do the same to Sunshine over the next 4 years if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Honestly, I can't believe Hurts is sticking around at Bama. GTFOT dude?!...

These kids are like cattle to coaches. Coaches do what's best for them all the time, kids should do the same.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby uscbucsfan » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:40 am

Super K wrote:You guys/gals are right on.

The other piece that pisses me off is the "coach speak". They interviewed Dabo, prior to Bryant making his decision, and when asked his thoughts on Bryant staying/leaving he said "I hope he does (stay)...we need him and we are gonna need him this season."

Then maybe you shouldn't have benched your Senior QB, whom lead you back to the playoffs last year and was undefeated this year, for your shiny new freshman toy.

And guess what?...he'll do the same to Sunshine over the next 4 years if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Honestly, I can't believe Hurts is sticking around at Bama. GTFOT dude?!...

These kids are like cattle to coaches. Coaches do what's best for them all the time, kids should do the same.

The best player should play, period. Kelly Bryant isn't nearly as good as Trevor Lawrence.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:44 am

USC nailed it imo. It's not that Bryant transferred, it was his comments about "not being given a fair shot". That is just sour grapes and it rubbed people the wrong way. Look at that Tua kid at Bama and what that offense is now capable of compared to when Jalen Hurts was/is playing QB. Clemson/Dabo was in a very similar situation. Clemson has legit playoff aspirations where they'll be facing the Ohio State and Bama caliber teams. If they expect to win those game they will need to be able to score points and Trevor Lawrence seems puts them in a MUCH better situation to do so compared to Kelly Bryant. Same way Tua does for Bama.

People should have NO issue with any other person doing what they feel is best for themselves.

Kelly Bryant is eligible to play next season wherever he wants. He should come down to UF and play for Dan Mullen, seems like a perfect skillset for what Mullen likes in a QB. Mullen is the guy who has coached Alex Smith-Tebow-Dak-Nick Fitzgerald. Pretty much every QB Mullen has been able to groom has been uber productive in college dating back to Joshua Harris at Bowling Green.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:54 am

What do you all think of the new redshirt rule that allows him to get another year....a kid can play in up to 4 games in a year and still redshirt and not have the year count.

(remove it from this particular context...what do you think about the rule in general)?
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby MJW » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:10 am

I wasn't trying to make this Bryant specific. Just speaking on more general terms.

Everybody needs to look out for themselves in their professional lives. Nobody is going to do it for you. Least of all a football program.

S'all.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Zarniwoop » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:16 am

MJW wrote:I wasn't trying to make this Bryant specific. Just speaking on more general terms.

Everybody needs to look out for themselves in their professional lives. Nobody is going to do it for you. Least of all a football program.

S'all.



Honestly deep down I think most people understand that. People get pissed immediately after it happens when the story is still "hot" but in the long run I haven't seen too many fans hold long term grudges.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Buc2 » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:50 am

MJW wrote:I've been giving this some thought.

Your school has a QB battle between two top recruits.

One guy wins, one guy loses.

The loser immediately declares he's transferring to somewhere where he'll play.

Which statement best describes your response?

A) He made a commitment, and he's dishonoring that commitment. And this venerable program. Something something something, brotherhood. Something Something Something, Tradition. ETC.
B) I don't really hold it against him, but if he's the kind of kid who gives up that easy, I don't want him here anyway. Good riddance.
C) I don't blame him for looking out for himself. He's trying to build an NFL resume and he can't do that on a bench.
D) Other?

Been talking to hardcore Clemson fans about Kelly Bryant. I was considering playing it down the middle in the OP, but I have to be honest: I think some fans are completely full of ****. This kid is looking out for his future. Honor and commitment and blah blah blah, except here's the thing - if he spends the next few years rotting on the bench, it's not like Clemson's booster club is going to write him a "Great Team Guy" check he can live on when he doesn't get any NFL consideration.

Also, most of the people blathering about disrespecting the team and the brotherhood...If they got demoted at work, and another company offered to give them a very important position where they could build their resumes...bullshit they'd say, "Oh, no, I'm loyal to my work team that just informed me they don't believe in me, so forget your better offer!" No they wouldn't. They'd take the better offer because they're not insane.

People are self-interested, and for the most part, we get that, except as sports fans. As sports fans we expect "our" athletes to be loyal to the organizations and ideals that define us for three hours of recreational time on Saturday. Monday through Friday, we're taking the best deal, looking to make the most money, looking for the best opportunity, etc. But God Forbid a guy who plays football for our amusement tries to do the same.

Without reading beyond your 4 possible answers, my answer is C.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Buc2 » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:53 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Will Grier immediately sprung to mind, but that was different.

Same with his WR David Sills but he switched positions.

I'll find an example that works eventually. Thinking its more common than we think.

USF's starter at QB did it. Twice.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blake_Barnett
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Super K » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:55 am

uscbucsfan wrote:
Super K wrote:You guys/gals are right on.

The other piece that pisses me off is the "coach speak". They interviewed Dabo, prior to Bryant making his decision, and when asked his thoughts on Bryant staying/leaving he said "I hope he does (stay)...we need him and we are gonna need him this season."

Then maybe you shouldn't have benched your Senior QB, whom lead you back to the playoffs last year and was undefeated this year, for your shiny new freshman toy.

And guess what?...he'll do the same to Sunshine over the next 4 years if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Honestly, I can't believe Hurts is sticking around at Bama. GTFOT dude?!...

These kids are like cattle to coaches. Coaches do what's best for them all the time, kids should do the same.

The best player should play, period. Kelly Bryant isn't nearly as good as Trevor Lawrence.



Totally good with that...1000% good with that...

But don't be surprised/upset/frustrated/let down etc when choice #2 decides to leave and go somewhere else where he'll be "the best player"....

THAT'S the issue...because coaches wanna have their cake and eat it too...high ceiling, hot shot, super talented youngin leading the run, BUT just in case, steady Eddy, mature and seasoned vet is sitting on the bench ready in case **** goes sideways...
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Kress » Fri Sep 28, 2018 10:37 am

Super K wrote:THAT'S the issue...because coaches wanna have their cake and eat it too...high ceiling, hot shot, super talented youngin leading the run, BUT just in case, steady Eddy, mature and seasoned vet is sitting on the bench ready in case **** goes sideways...



You lost me. How is that an issue? Of course coaches want that. Who wouldn't? Just because you have Stud #1, that doesn't mean that you should happily ship Stud #1a off to a different team. Screw that.

The Player wants to be Stud #1 on his team. If he isn't, but he can be on another team that's equally-well exposed or better (or I guess even if less but close enough), he's bolting for that team and he should.

Same for the Coach. The Coach wants Stud #1, #1a, #1b, #1c, and then maybe toss in a #2 and #2a as well. Why wouldn't he? And of course if someone better than #1 comes along, loyalty to his former guy doesn't say that he shouldn't bump him and everyone else down a notch any more than loyalty says player #1a should decline to leave.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby PanteraCanes » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:20 am

Zarniwoop wrote:What do you all think of the new redshirt rule that allows him to get another year....a kid can play in up to 4 games in a year and still redshirt and not have the year count.

(remove it from this particular context...what do you think about the rule in general)?


For Miami it has been nice. There are a few freshmen players that have gotten playing time that might not have if there was a possibility they might get a redshirt.


As far as the overall discussion, I think these kids should look at their education first. A very small minority of them will even get a cup of water in the NFL, much less get to make a living out of it. This probably applies more to underclassmen who declare early, but I can' imagine constantly transferring to different schools does anything but make it harder to finish your degree.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby PanteraCanes » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:24 am

Also, sometimes you can still have a pretty good NFL career even if there is competition on the squad.

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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Cheb » Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:53 pm

I'm somewhere between B and C. I understand a player transferring if he loses a position battle, he has to do what he thinks is best for him and his family.

But if he's that arrogant I say good riddance. If he wants to transfer after losing a position battle then he never gave a shat about your program anyway. Your team was a means to his end, he didn't get his way, now he's off to try the same thing elsewhere. Have fun at Directional State University. Nice knowing you.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Fri Sep 28, 2018 1:25 pm

Cheb wrote:I'm somewhere between B and C. I understand a player transferring if he loses a position battle, he has to do what he thinks is best for him and his family.

But if he's that arrogant I say good riddance. If he wants to transfer after losing a position battle then he never gave a shat about your program anyway. Your team was a means to his end, he didn't get his way, now he's off to try the same thing elsewhere. Have fun at Directional State University. Nice knowing you.

Isn't the program a means to an end for any college player with serious NFL ambitions?

I get that if you're a walk-on, unrated, non-scholarship player, that you're hanging on to try and get your tuition paid, but if you're a blue chip, all-state, HS superjock, The coaches come to YOU. They give em' the song and dance "we put more guys in the NFL than anybody in the whole wide world" to get them into their program and if the kid takes that full-ride offer, the expectation is that he's going to ride you all the way to a hug with Roger Goodell.

If it doesn't shake out that way, I not only have no qualms about the kid being able to transfer, but I think he shouldn't lose any time for doing it.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Fri Sep 28, 2018 1:31 pm

The thought conjures up shenanigans by Boosters, official visits where the upperclassmen take a kid to a frat party and have some sorority girl treat him like a rockstar....
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby Crocaneers » Fri Sep 28, 2018 2:34 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Will Grier immediately sprung to mind, but that was different.

Same with his WR David Sills but he switched positions.

I'll find an example that works eventually. Thinking its more common than we think.


First thing I thought .. Grier was in a bad wind at UF and nothing he could do but eject. Imagine what would have happened, had he tried to take the high road.

Don't mention the crap NCAA suspension, etc .. that was going away until he transfers and then all things dropped


now he's in the hunt for the Heisman
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby MJW » Sat Sep 29, 2018 6:30 am

Cheb wrote:I'm somewhere between B and C. I understand a player transferring if he loses a position battle, he has to do what he thinks is best for him and his family.

But if he's that arrogant I say good riddance. If he wants to transfer after losing a position battle then he never gave a shat about your program anyway. Your team was a means to his end, he didn't get his way, now he's off to try the same thing elsewhere. Have fun at Directional State University. Nice knowing you.


This is reasonable.

Nebraska just lost a QB this way...left the program (for Oregon State) when he lost out to Adrian Martinez.

The general posture was both, "That's his right" and "Sack up, kid - you didn't lose to Tim Tebow here."

I think one of the reasons sports fans can get upset about this stuff is it shatters the illusion you're talking about. This idea that the "team" is anything more than a means to an end for most players, and they really love your school as much as you do. I've found, living in a college town and knowing most of the Huskers you've heard of (and hundreds nobody has), that the kids who DO think that way are rarely the stars anyone cares about. I know a lot of two-stars and walk-ons from places like Hebron, Nebraska who think being on the Cornhuskers is the greatest thing ever, and they think they're in heaven. The guys people care about just see it as a stepping stone to the next thing.
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby BucJordan » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:31 am

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Will Grier immediately sprung to mind, but that was different.

Same with his WR David Sills but he switched positions.

I'll find an example that works eventually. Thinking its more common than we think.


Russell Wilson?
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Re: Question For College Football Fans (That Turns Into A Ra

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:27 am

BucJordan wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Will Grier immediately sprung to mind, but that was different.

Same with his WR David Sills but he switched positions.

I'll find an example that works eventually. Thinking its more common than we think.


Russell Wilson?


homie didn't want to go face to face with the war giraffe. can you blame him?
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