Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:06 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDlSjTe0zuE


Correction. His best snaps come when he's completely unblocked. Now I see why he's not projected higher than he is.


Same can be said for Key if we're being honest. He doesn't have much good tape showing off pass rush moves vs Tackles.

Just sayin. I like Key over Carter, but it's a fair comp imo. Better than Key-Davenport.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:18 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
Correction. His best snaps come when he's completely unblocked. Now I see why he's not projected higher than he is.


Same can be said for Key if we're being honest. He doesn't have much good tape showing off pass rush moves vs Tackles.

Just sayin. I like Key over Carter, but it's a fair comp imo. Better than Key-Davenport.


Except Key has experience as a defensive end, has pass rush technique, plays with his hand in the dirt. He doesn't have the small sample size Carter has because he is an end unlike Carter. Why you guys are choosing to double down on stupid comparing guys of different positions. Might as well see if Derwin James can play on the boundary.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby real bucs fan » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:55 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:
Same can be said for Key if we're being honest. He doesn't have much good tape showing off pass rush moves vs Tackles.

Just sayin. I like Key over Carter, but it's a fair comp imo. Better than Key-Davenport.


Except Key has experience as a defensive end, has pass rush technique, plays with his hand in the dirt. He doesn't have the small sample size Carter has because he is an end unlike Carter. Why you guys are choosing to double down on stupid comparing guys of different positions. Might as well see if Derwin James can play on the boundary.

Again, Carter and Key will be playing the same position in the NFL. They both are going to be light in the ass edge rushers.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:05 pm

real bucs fan wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
Except Key has experience as a defensive end, has pass rush technique, plays with his hand in the dirt. He doesn't have the small sample size Carter has because he is an end unlike Carter. Why you guys are choosing to double down on stupid comparing guys of different positions. Might as well see if Derwin James can play on the boundary.

Again, Carter and Key will be playing the same position in the NFL. They both are going to be light in the ass edge rushers.


No they won't. Carter is a LB and will be such. You're trying to fill an agenda but like is the usual you're wrong.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:21 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:Again, Carter and Key will be playing the same position in the NFL. They both are going to be light in the ass edge rushers.


No they won't. Carter is a LB and will be such. You're trying to fill an agenda but like is the usual you're wrong.


I think you're wrong here, but we'll see. I'd bet Carter is coming off the edge regardless of scheme. He doesn't have the lateral mobility to play off the ball in the NFL imo.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Super K » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:10 pm

I say let's draftem both and find out..

1Chubb
2Key
3Carter

Or

1Vea
2Key
3Carter

Or

1Nelson
2Key
3Carter

Any scenerio, I'm PERFECTLY fine with..
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby real bucs fan » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:22 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
No they won't. Carter is a LB and will be such. You're trying to fill an agenda but like is the usual you're wrong.


I think you're wrong here, but we'll see. I'd bet Carter is coming off the edge regardless of scheme. He doesn't have the lateral mobility to play off the ball in the NFL imo.

Carter has the versatility to play some off the ball, but that shouldn't be a knock on him. Heck he even lined up at nickel occasionally. And I do think he has the lateral mobility to play off the ball, but with their being such a premium on pass rushers, I don't see how teams don't look at him as one. Some teams might view him as a LEO type though.
Last edited by real bucs fan on Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:24 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
No they won't. Carter is a LB and will be such. You're trying to fill an agenda but like is the usual you're wrong.


I think you're wrong here, but we'll see. I'd bet Carter is coming off the edge regardless of scheme. He doesn't have the lateral mobility to play off the ball in the NFL imo.


He also doesn't have the strength at the POA, hand usage or pass rush ability to play with his hand in the dirt. That is why he's a 4th round prospect at best. His production speaks to his lack of a true home on the field.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:04 pm

Mata'afa is still my guy.

He's gonna be a star in the NFL. Best first step in this class. Good rip, nose for the ball, and hits like a middle linebacker.

It'll take a Doug Martin trade to get him in the top of the second, but it'll be totally worth it.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:19 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Mata'afa is still my guy.

He's gonna be a star in the NFL. Best first step in this class. Good rip, nose for the ball, and hits like a middle linebacker.

It'll take a Doug Martin trade to get him in the top of the second, but it'll be totally worth it.


He's a complete project. That trade won't be necessary as he'll be available in the 4th.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:54 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Mata'afa is still my guy.

He's gonna be a star in the NFL. Best first step in this class. Good rip, nose for the ball, and hits like a middle linebacker.

It'll take a Doug Martin trade to get him in the top of the second, but it'll be totally worth it.


He's a complete project. That trade won't be necessary as he'll be available in the 4th.

You're full of ****.

He could be gone by 35.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:01 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
He's a complete project. That trade won't be necessary as he'll be available in the 4th.

You're full of ****.

He could be gone by 35.


A 255 pound college DT who's moving to the edge and isn't the best athlete is a top 35 player in your eyes?? Sucks to suck. There's basically no film on him since he's moving to the edge. That's not a player you take top 35, 50 or 100 for that matter.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:08 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:You're full of ****.

He could be gone by 35.


A 255 pound college DT who's moving to the edge and isn't the best athlete is a top 35 player in your eyes?? Sucks to suck. There's basically no film on him since he's moving to the edge. That's not a player you take top 35, 50 or 100 for that matter.

Yeah, im sure you read the same bullshit on nfl.com I read.

That was a casual ass take on a damned good prospect. Mark my words, he's going to be special and he's going to be on a plane to his new home when day 3 begins.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:13 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
A 255 pound college DT who's moving to the edge and isn't the best athlete is a top 35 player in your eyes?? Sucks to suck. There's basically no film on him since he's moving to the edge. That's not a player you take top 35, 50 or 100 for that matter.

Yeah, im sure you read the same bullshit on nfl.com I read.

That was a casual ass take on a damned good prospect. Mark my words, he's going to be special and he's going to be on a plane to his new home when day 3 begins.


No, those internet scouting reports are 1 "analysts" POV. I agree he's good but you're dismissing the switch as well as other circumstances. Your take of "he's going to be special, make my words" are more than casual. You don't use any valid reasoning, analysis, nothing. All you're coming with is "mark my words, he's a damned good prospect". No team is spending a top 35 pick on a guy like that. I would take him in the 4th.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:15 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Yeah, im sure you read the same bullshit on nfl.com I read.

That was a casual ass take on a damned good prospect. Mark my words, he's going to be special and he's going to be on a plane to his new home when day 3 begins.


No, those internet scouting reports are 1 "analysts" POV. I agree he's good but you're dismissing the switch as well as other circumstances. Your take of "he's going to be special, make my words" are more than casual. You don't use any valid reasoning, analysis, nothing. All you're coming with is "mark my words, he's a damned good prospect". No team is spending a top 35 pick on a guy like that. I would take him in the 4th.

And when he's taken on day two, I'm gonna put you in the time out forum until the draft is over.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:36 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
No, those internet scouting reports are 1 "analysts" POV. I agree he's good but you're dismissing the switch as well as other circumstances. Your take of "he's going to be special, make my words" are more than casual. You don't use any valid reasoning, analysis, nothing. All you're coming with is "mark my words, he's a damned good prospect". No team is spending a top 35 pick on a guy like that. I would take him in the 4th.

And when he's taken on day two, I'm gonna put you in the time out forum until the draft is over.


Okay Mod IV
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Doctor » Mon Mar 05, 2018 12:49 am

So can we put the Davenport at 7 talk to bed now?
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 4:39 am

Doctor wrote:So can we put the Davenport at 7 talk to bed now?


OK, we sell Nelson to the Niners for both their 3rd's and then pick him!
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bucs N Beers » Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:25 am

If we are going to draft Davenport, we had damn well better trade back to 15+. Also, we better draft at least one more DE.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby DreadNaught » Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:36 am

Davenport at 7 would be richer than I'd prefer, but I really like him as a prospect. He just needs coaching. Love his size, length, strength, and effort. Great athlete, just raw..

He's going high, top 15 I'd bet. EDGE rushers with his traits don't stay on the board long usually.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:46 am

Wait, don't take him at 7 but trade back to 15? Y'all are trying to be too cute. If that's the case take him at 7 and be done. Those 8 spots won't make a difference.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Jason Bourne » Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:50 am

Take Davenport at 7 if Chubb and Nelson are gone.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:03 am

Jason Bourne wrote:Take Davenport at 7 if Chubb and Nelson are gone.



Without trying to sell Minkah?
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Jason Bourne » Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:40 am

mdb1958 wrote:
Jason Bourne wrote:Take Davenport at 7 if Chubb and Nelson are gone.



Without trying to sell Minkah?


Why risk missing out on a DE ?
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Noles1724 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 11:07 am

Bootz2004 wrote:Wait, don't take him at 7 but trade back to 15? Y'all are trying to be too cute. If that's the case take him at 7 and be done. Those 8 spots won't make a difference.


The compensation in return would be though
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby real bucs fan » Mon Mar 05, 2018 11:13 am

If noone falls to us, I could get behind taking Davenport at 7. It would be a reach for sure, but we are that desperate for an edge, and he does have the upside to eventually be worth the pick. I don't see him stepping in as a rookie and making an impact though, so I hope folks are mindful of that.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby Bootz2004 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 11:14 am

Noles1724 wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:Wait, don't take him at 7 but trade back to 15? Y'all are trying to be too cute. If that's the case take him at 7 and be done. Those 8 spots won't make a difference.


The compensation in return would be though


Is it worth the risk? That's what I mean by trying to win the draft. You're talking about dropping 8 spots and hoping the player you wanted at 7 is still there at 15. Why try to be cute?
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby real bucs fan » Mon Mar 05, 2018 12:22 pm

Day 3 DE to keep an eye on... Kylie Fitts out of Utah. Great short area explosion numbers... was pretty much a bandaid through his college career, but there is major upside here if he can stay healthy.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 12:29 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Noles1724 wrote:
The compensation in return would be though


Is it worth the risk? That's what I mean by trying to win the draft. You're talking about dropping 8 spots and hoping the player you wanted at 7 is still there at 15. Why try to be cute?


You make it a minimal drop trade and if someone grabs him you go to plan 2 and take Vea. You could get real creative on defense with that tackle.
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Re: Draft Watch: Defensive Ends

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 12:33 pm

Bucs N beers needs to explain his thinking.
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