Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

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Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Cheb » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:19 pm

Winston is the entrenched starter. Glennon is probably going to sign elsewhere for large amounts of money. Griffin would probably be disastrous if he were the starter.

The question becomes should the Bucs stand pat, maybe add a veteran (probably for more than 5 million a year)? Or should they draft someone in the middle or late rounds to groom? Maybe both?

I've seen alot of people advocate for signing a veteran backup. For one, they would presumably not screw the pooch if they had to start in the case of an injury to Winston. But, they offer little upside and would most likely be expensive.

I am liking the idea of spending a middle or late rounder on a quarterback more and more. Anyone else agree? If so, anyone you are targeting?
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Heidguy » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:28 pm

If they do it needs to be a 6th, 7th round project guy.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Super K » Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:29 pm

Taking a project type guy means we carry 3 QBs again...thus the draftee must have some kind of skill and or ability to produce immediately (to some level)..

At some point I'd like us to draft a guy, I just don't know if we are there yet..

That being said, the available Vets are poop...so to the draft we go!!

Josh Dobbs comes to mind, but the name "Josh" at QB has me spooked..

So I'd take a later round flyer on Jerod Evans VT..

Griffin flat out sucks...
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Caradoc » Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:32 pm

No. I think Winston needs a vet in there with him for a couple or three years at least. I like Glennon more than most, but he was hardly a seasoned vet presence. I want someone else in the room with him and on the sidelines that can show him a different way of seeing/applying what the coaches are telling him than just his own way.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Super K » Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:36 pm

Caradoc wrote:No. I think Winston needs a vet in there with him for a couple or three years at least. I like Glennon more than most, but he was hardly a seasoned vet presence. I want someone else in the room with him and on the sidelines that can show him a different way of seeing/applying what the coaches are telling him than just his own way.


Don't disagree...

But who is available that can fill that role?
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 2:40 pm

Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby MJW » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:39 pm

mdb1958 wrote:Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves


I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby mdb1958 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 5:24 pm

MJW wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves


I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.


I done told yall, Favre's packer career was winning. And if it wasnt those int's would have sunk him.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Doctor » Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:17 pm

MJW wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves


I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.

Was about to say the same thing. Also, check out the Pats. Even if you can't trade them you still may end up with nice comp picks.

Winston is a franchise QB who hasn't missed a game. He's surrounded by great coaches and is a big book worm on his own as is. He doesn't need some vet back up showing him the ropes or anything. We need to strengthen the run game, which is the focus of this offense anyways. If we do that we can have a young guy hold the fort down for a few games with if need be. Anything more serious than that, doesn't really matter how vet the back up is. This isn't the 70s you just can't Earl Morrall your way to a championship these days. In fact, the only time something like that even comes close to happening is because a young gun took over (Brady, Big Ben, CK, etc). Not some savvy vet.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Naismith » Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:43 pm

I like Brad Kaaya as a later pick. I'm sure he wouldn't love being picked here but develop him for a few years, put up some preseason highlight plays and then cash in for a comp pick or trade down the road.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Bucs N Beers » Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:48 pm

Super K wrote:So I'd take a later round flyer on Jerod Evans VT..


Evans was my 5th round pick in my Pre-Combine Mock draft. Very possible he stays there again (going to wait until at least a week of free agency to do my Post-Combine Mock).

I don't think Winston necessarily needs a "vet presence". I think he has a very good surrounding coach group in HC Koetter, OC Monken, and QB Coach Bajakian.

I'd like to see us pick up a talented QB like Evans or Dobbs late in the draft and let them learn, then churn them for trade/compensatory.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Buc2 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:41 am

MJW wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves


I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.

This is good stuff. But I don't think we're at the point we can dabble in the luxury of adding mid-round QBs to use as trade bait in subsequent years. Maybe let us get to the point where we're a playoff team first.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby PanteraCanes » Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:18 am

Naismith wrote:I like Brad Kaaya as a later pick. I'm sure he wouldn't love being picked here but develop him for a few years, put up some preseason highlight plays and then cash in for a comp pick or trade down the road.



I think he just wants to be drafted anywhere. There are several Miami players I would like to see us get through the draft or possibly UDFA (Corn Elder, David Njoku, Stacy Coley, Danny Isidora, Jermaine Grace, Adrian Colbert), Kaaya is really not one of them.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Caradoc » Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:07 pm

Super K wrote:
Caradoc wrote:No. I think Winston needs a vet in there with him for a couple or three years at least. I like Glennon more than most, but he was hardly a seasoned vet presence. I want someone else in the room with him and on the sidelines that can show him a different way of seeing/applying what the coaches are telling him than just his own way.


Don't disagree...

But who is available that can fill that role?



Hoyer or Cassell would be the first I would think of.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Super K » Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:47 pm

Caradoc wrote:
Super K wrote:
Don't disagree...

But who is available that can fill that role?



Hoyer or Cassell would be the first I would think of.


We'll have to agree to disagree with those guys..

The only things I would want them to point out to JW are where the Gatorade is and who's holding the IPad (whatever the **** ever it is) after a series..
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Doctor » Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:23 am

Buc2 wrote:
MJW wrote:
I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.

This is good stuff. But I don't think we're at the point we can dabble in the luxury of adding mid-round QBs to use as trade bait in subsequent years. Maybe let us get to the point where we're a playoff team first.

Why not? We have a franchise QB. No intention of "grooming" any QBOTF (an acronym I'm glad I don't see much of anymore). Winston hasn't given us any durability concerns, quite the opposite.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Buc2 » Wed Mar 08, 2017 9:12 am

Doctor wrote:
Buc2 wrote:This is good stuff. But I don't think we're at the point we can dabble in the luxury of adding mid-round QBs to use as trade bait in subsequent years. Maybe let us get to the point where we're a playoff team first.

Why not? We have a franchise QB. No intention of "grooming" any QBOTF (an acronym I'm glad I don't see much of anymore). Winston hasn't given us any durability concerns, quite the opposite.

Because I think we need those mid-round picks more at other positions right now.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Nano » Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:33 pm

It could be argued that depth at QB is a need. Unless you think Griffin or Renfree could be a capable backup(neither has shown that)
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:34 pm

I'd rather have a young inexpensive QB with upside for the next 3-4 years than drop $7mil on a guy we know is mediocre at his very best.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Doctor » Wed Mar 08, 2017 1:03 pm

Buc2 wrote:
Doctor wrote:Why not? We have a franchise QB. No intention of "grooming" any QBOTF (an acronym I'm glad I don't see much of anymore). Winston hasn't given us any durability concerns, quite the opposite.

Because I think we need those mid-round picks more at other positions right now.

What positions? Back up QB is an extremely important position. Probably the most important depth position on the team. Which is what those picks tend to be. Sure, you get an occasional starter from the mid rounds, but usually it's role players, depth, and busts. We're not coming way from this draft with 7 new starters.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Caradoc » Wed Mar 08, 2017 7:04 pm

Doctor wrote:
MJW wrote:
I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.

Was about to say the same thing. Also, check out the Pats. Even if you can't trade them you still may end up with nice comp picks.

Winston is a franchise QB who hasn't missed a game. He's surrounded by great coaches and is a big book worm on his own as is. He doesn't need some vet back up showing him the ropes or anything. We need to strengthen the run game, which is the focus of this offense anyways. If we do that we can have a young guy hold the fort down for a few games with if need be. Anything more serious than that, doesn't really matter how vet the back up is. This isn't the 70s you just can't Earl Morrall your way to a championship these days. In fact, the only time something like that even comes close to happening is because a young gun took over (Brady, Big Ben, CK, etc). Not some savvy vet.


It's anot about getting someone to "show him the ropes". It's about an extra viewpoint, extra set of eyes. Someone who isn't his "boss" like the coaches, but a coworker he can relate to and respect. Regardless of anything else, he's still just 23. He hasn't seen it all, hasn't "been there done that" for long at this level. Having someone around who has been around for a long time would be a big help for him.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Kress » Thu Mar 09, 2017 8:12 am

Buc2 wrote:
MJW wrote:
I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.

This is good stuff. But I don't think we're at the point we can dabble in the luxury of adding mid-round QBs to use as trade bait in subsequent years. Maybe let us get to the point where we're a playoff team first.



But you can't be myopic and focus only on the immediate. To MJW's point, there is a reason why the Pats have a perennial contender, and it's not just Brady. Having a franchise qb is great. Having a franchise qb team around your qb is better.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby terrytate » Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:42 pm

MJW wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Nope, I wouldnt waste a draft pick. I wouldnt think like that until our talent is sliding off the shelves


I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.



When you already have a winner built and looking for long term sustain, sure? We aren't there yet. We have enough holes and depth issues to give playing time to day 3 guys, maybe even start one. When we have a deep team and are threatening to make a deep run every year, then we go that route by design.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby MJW » Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:56 pm

terrytate wrote:
MJW wrote:
I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.



When you already have a winner built and looking for long term sustain, sure? We aren't there yet. We have enough holes and depth issues to give playing time to day 3 guys, maybe even start one. When we have a deep team and are threatening to make a deep run every year, then we go that route by design.


This depends on what round we're talking.

Should we draft a QB on Day Two? Or in the 4th Round? No.

5-7? Yes. Especially since we have basically nothing at the position right now. Brett Hundley and AJ McCarron both come to mind. Both were Day Three picks by teams that didn't need a QB. Both have provided peace of mind for their teams. Both could be flipped for draft picks if their teams choose. Both will be worth comp picks when they leave.

The potential downside is they don't work out, like 90% of picks taken in those rounds.

That's good math to me.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Doctor » Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:19 am

terrytate wrote:
MJW wrote:
I go the other way with it. Draft a quarterback you like (obviously) every. single. year.

The Ron Wolf school of thought. They drafted one almost every year even though they had Favre, who needed a backup less than any QB in the history of football. And what was the upshot? They were able to get returns in trades on a ton of them. Off the top of my head, Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, and Ty Detmer were all Wolf draft picks post-Favre and several of them were dealt for juicy picks. And heck, if something had happened to Favre they would have been in good shape most years with those guys.

My guy this year is Josh Dobbs from Tennessee.



When you already have a winner built and looking for long term sustain, sure? We aren't there yet. We have enough holes and depth issues to give playing time to day 3 guys, maybe even start one. When we have a deep team and are threatening to make a deep run every year, then we go that route by design.

Again, what makes the back up OG more important than the back up QB? The back up QB is possibly the most important back up on the team, he's PART of the team. If you are using a day 3 pick on depth then QB DEPTH is as good a spot as any, if not more.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby terrytate » Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:20 am

MJW wrote:
terrytate wrote:

When you already have a winner built and looking for long term sustain, sure? We aren't there yet. We have enough holes and depth issues to give playing time to day 3 guys, maybe even start one. When we have a deep team and are threatening to make a deep run every year, then we go that route by design.


This depends on what round we're talking.

Should we draft a QB on Day Two? Or in the 4th Round? No.

5-7? Yes. Especially since we have basically nothing at the position right now. Brett Hundley and AJ McCarron both come to mind. Both were Day Three picks by teams that didn't need a QB. Both have provided peace of mind for their teams. Both could be flipped for draft picks if their teams choose. Both will be worth comp picks when they leave.

The potential downside is they don't work out, like 90% of picks taken in those rounds.

That's good math to me.


I get the logic. I am just saying we aren't in a position to roll the dice on this when we have so many immediate needs. Plus, lets not forget that such a gambit is still a gamble. A round 5-7 QB is still highly likely to have no value at all.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby terrytate » Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:24 am

Doctor wrote:
terrytate wrote:

When you already have a winner built and looking for long term sustain, sure? We aren't there yet. We have enough holes and depth issues to give playing time to day 3 guys, maybe even start one. When we have a deep team and are threatening to make a deep run every year, then we go that route by design.

Again, what makes the back up OG more important than the back up QB? The back up QB is possibly the most important back up on the team, he's PART of the team. If you are using a day 3 pick on depth then QB DEPTH is as good a spot as any, if not more.



You missed my previous post then. We are in a position to give snaps to guys we pick in the later rounds. Would anyone really be shocked in a 5th rounder won the safety job, or the nickle/dime CB job? If nothing else, these guys might be our special teams unit.

This isn't the year for that gamble. We are building a winner, not upkeeping one.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Kress » Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:51 am

terrytate wrote:This isn't the year for that gamble. We are building a winner, not upkeeping one.



Building for what, tate? A one-year flash in the pan, or a long term winner that would just so happen to match the window of many of our young studs? It's a bit like chess. If you're not thinking at least 3-4 moves ahead, you're already losing.
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby Doctor » Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:08 pm

terrytate wrote:
Doctor wrote:Again, what makes the back up OG more important than the back up QB? The back up QB is possibly the most important back up on the team, he's PART of the team. If you are using a day 3 pick on depth then QB DEPTH is as good a spot as any, if not more.



You missed my previous post then. We are in a position to give snaps to guys we pick in the later rounds. Would anyone really be shocked in a 5th rounder won the safety job, or the nickle/dime CB job? If nothing else, these guys might be our special teams unit.

This isn't the year for that gamble. We are building a winner, not upkeeping one.

You're not wrong. But it's never really "a year" for that. I'd be fine with not getting a QB. It's BPA. But it really comes down to how the draft falls. COULD a 5th rounder win a starting spot? Sure, anything could happen. But if there isn't really a player out there that you think can, and you have a guys like Kayaa or Dobbs still in the 6th....
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Re: Should the Bucs draft a quarterback this year?

Postby bearlandbucfan » Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:13 pm

Backup QB is becoming an increasingly-important roster position. Winston is definitely the entrenched starter, but we all know injuries can change teams even before the first regular season snap. I'm not really keen on the idea of RGB III or some of the other backup prospects in FA right now. I fully expect we will draft a QB.
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