Vita Vea

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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Super K » Wed May 09, 2018 11:34 am

mdb1958 wrote:Before I even see him making plays for us (Vea), I think he would have made the Bronco defense better than he will the first year with us.

Why?
Easy, he has more to work with.

I dont see him as the finishing piece with us, we are going to have to add greatness into the mix with him. Fresh "greatness" if you will...

This group could surprise me and be a bunch of overachievers this year but still I look at it as short term. I hope we are blessed with the chance to add some super good talent around him in the next couple of years. Get ahead of the curve --- instead of constantly behind it.


I know we kick you in the crotch alot, but this is a heckuva post..

100% agree with you..
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Buc2 » Wed May 09, 2018 11:46 am

mdb1958 wrote:Before I even see him making plays for us (Vea), I think he would have made the Bronco defense better than he will the first year with us.

Why?
Easy, he has more to work with.

I dont see him as the finishing piece with us, we are going to have to add greatness into the mix with him. Fresh "greatness" if you will...

This group could surprise me and be a bunch of overachievers this year but still I look at it as short term. I hope we are blessed with the chance to add some super good talent around him in the next couple of years. Get ahead of the curve --- instead of constantly behind it.

This times a thousand!
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Heidguy » Wed May 09, 2018 11:49 am

Super K wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Before I even see him making plays for us (Vea), I think he would have made the Bronco defense better than he will the first year with us.

Why?
Easy, he has more to work with.

I dont see him as the finishing piece with us, we are going to have to add greatness into the mix with him. Fresh "greatness" if you will...

This group could surprise me and be a bunch of overachievers this year but still I look at it as short term. I hope we are blessed with the chance to add some super good talent around him in the next couple of years. Get ahead of the curve --- instead of constantly behind it.


I know we kick you in the crotch alot, but this is a heckuva post..

100% agree with you..


Hell I thought I was seeing things, this absolutely is a very solid post! Given the person that posted it, I'd consider this post of the year at this point. You have to of course take into consideration his usual posts.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed May 09, 2018 4:53 pm

Mdb was high when he wrote that.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Hatter » Wed May 09, 2018 7:21 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Mdb was high when he wrote that.


I KNEW IT!!
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby terrytate » Thu May 10, 2018 1:27 am

mdb1958 wrote:Before I even see him making plays for us (Vea), I think he would have made the Bronco defense better than he will the first year with us.

Why?
Easy, he has more to work with.

I dont see him as the finishing piece with us, we are going to have to add greatness into the mix with him. Fresh "greatness" if you will...

This group could surprise me and be a bunch of overachievers this year but still I look at it as short term. I hope we are blessed with the chance to add some super good talent around him in the next couple of years. Get ahead of the curve --- instead of constantly behind it.



Your post glosses over one fact. Our Dline IS a short term solution, Vea was the first step in a long term answer.

If all goes well, Vea will be the cornerstone of the Dline after McCoy hangs it up. We will obviously need more pass rushers to have plan B in place for when JPP and Curry start to fall of, but he we are in a good place now.

Besides, the Bronco's got Bradley Chubb. I don't think they are crying into their ham and eggs over missing out on Vea.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby MJW » Thu May 10, 2018 2:22 am

terrytate wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Before I even see him making plays for us (Vea), I think he would have made the Bronco defense better than he will the first year with us.

Why?
Easy, he has more to work with.

I dont see him as the finishing piece with us, we are going to have to add greatness into the mix with him. Fresh "greatness" if you will...

This group could surprise me and be a bunch of overachievers this year but still I look at it as short term. I hope we are blessed with the chance to add some super good talent around him in the next couple of years. Get ahead of the curve --- instead of constantly behind it.



Your post glosses over one fact. Our Dline IS a short term solution, Vea was the first step in a long term answer.

If all goes well, Vea will be the cornerstone of the Dline after McCoy hangs it up. We will obviously need more pass rushers to have plan B in place for when JPP and Curry start to fall of, but he we are in a good place now.

Besides, the Bronco's got Bradley Chubb. I don't think they are crying into their ham and eggs over missing out on Vea.


Putting aside the players themselves (whether they hit or bust, etc), you really never find yourself saying, "Damn, we have too many good defensive linemen, we should have used that pick somewhere else!" My favorite pick of the 1st round was the Jaguars saying, "We have Malik Jackson, Calais Campbell, Dante Fowler, Yannick Ngakoue, Marcel Dareus, etc...let's draft Taven Bryan! They could have done the obvious thing. Plugged in a slot corner. Added a talented receiver. A top tight end. Even an heir to Bortles. Nope. They saw a mad dog defensive lineman and pulled the trigger. Good on them.

The "Copying the Eagles" schtick is everywhere, but it's been a sound strategy since way before four months ago.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby terrytate » Fri May 11, 2018 8:41 am

MJW wrote:
terrytate wrote:

Your post glosses over one fact. Our Dline IS a short term solution, Vea was the first step in a long term answer.

If all goes well, Vea will be the cornerstone of the Dline after McCoy hangs it up. We will obviously need more pass rushers to have plan B in place for when JPP and Curry start to fall of, but he we are in a good place now.

Besides, the Bronco's got Bradley Chubb. I don't think they are crying into their ham and eggs over missing out on Vea.


Putting aside the players themselves (whether they hit or bust, etc), you really never find yourself saying, "Damn, we have too many good defensive linemen, we should have used that pick somewhere else!" My favorite pick of the 1st round was the Jaguars saying, "We have Malik Jackson, Calais Campbell, Dante Fowler, Yannick Ngakoue, Marcel Dareus, etc...let's draft Taven Bryan! They could have done the obvious thing. Plugged in a slot corner. Added a talented receiver. A top tight end. Even an heir to Bortles. Nope. They saw a mad dog defensive lineman and pulled the trigger. Good on them.

The "Copying the Eagles" schtick is everywhere, but it's been a sound strategy since way before four months ago.


Agreed. Even though I had a big mancrush on James, I got over it pretty quick with Vea. I have a much better feeling about him than I have about any defensive lineman we've drafted since McCoy.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby DreadNaught » Fri May 11, 2018 9:18 am

Vea (hopefully) gives the Bucs a young cornerstone DT for the next decade to build around. We have the depth right now w/ McCoy, JPP, Curry to potentially be a damn good Dline for 2-3 years, so the pressure isn't on Vea year 1 to be an All-Pro.

I'll say this, we have some really good pieces in place along the Dline. Couple that with Jameis hopefully taking the next step in his young career and you have imo the two most important things in football which are a good QB and dominate Dline. I can't remember too many bad teams that are good-great in those two areas. The Giants of last season come to mind, but I think they are more the exception than the rule.

It's all on paper right and up to the players and coaches to make it happen. But I can't really knock the Vea pick or what Licht has done this offseason. He's done a fantastic job addressing the roster this offseason without mortgaging the future.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Cheb » Fri May 11, 2018 10:04 am

terrytate wrote:
MJW wrote:
Putting aside the players themselves (whether they hit or bust, etc), you really never find yourself saying, "Damn, we have too many good defensive linemen, we should have used that pick somewhere else!" My favorite pick of the 1st round was the Jaguars saying, "We have Malik Jackson, Calais Campbell, Dante Fowler, Yannick Ngakoue, Marcel Dareus, etc...let's draft Taven Bryan! They could have done the obvious thing. Plugged in a slot corner. Added a talented receiver. A top tight end. Even an heir to Bortles. Nope. They saw a mad dog defensive lineman and pulled the trigger. Good on them.

The "Copying the Eagles" schtick is everywhere, but it's been a sound strategy since way before four months ago.


Agreed. Even though I had a big mancrush on James, I got over it pretty quick with Vea. I have a much better feeling about him than I have about any defensive lineman we've drafted since McCoy.


I agree with that, and it isn't even close. I think he can be the next Linval Joseph. He may never get more than five sacks a season, but if he works on his craft (specifically pad height, hand usage, and consistent rush plans), he could be a very good football player.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Doctor » Mon May 21, 2018 9:00 am

The thing is that you are never "set" at DL and the moment you think you are is when it starts to fall apart. It's incredibly difficult to maintain a dominant trench for more than a window. Besides your usual ageing, you have other positions that need to be addressed, you have guys looking for huge paydays, you guys making dumb decisions, you have great players you refuse to pay because you have a promising youngster right behind him for far less, the but youngster turns into a dud. And more so than other positions, DL is incredibly co-dependent and one piece can take everyone up a notch to probowlers or down a notch to duds.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby mdb1958 » Tue May 22, 2018 5:16 pm

McCoy's nickname for Vea


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Re: Vita Vea

Postby MJW » Wed May 23, 2018 11:15 pm

Doctor wrote:The thing is that you are never "set" at DL and the moment you think you are is when it starts to fall apart. It's incredibly difficult to maintain a dominant trench for more than a window. Besides your usual ageing, you have other positions that need to be addressed, you have guys looking for huge paydays, you guys making dumb decisions, you have great players you refuse to pay because you have a promising youngster right behind him for far less, the but youngster turns into a dud. And more so than other positions, DL is incredibly co-dependent and one piece can take everyone up a notch to probowlers or down a notch to duds.


I'd agree with this. It's probably true everywhere, but especially on the defensive line. It isn't like other positions, where you play basically the same guys for 70 snaps, which some occasional and situational substitutions. If a defensive lineman is dressed, he's going to get snaps. And probably meaningful ones. If you don't have starters AND depth, you need to keep adding pieces. And if you DO have starters and depth, you need to keep adding pieces.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Doctor » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:25 am

Indeed. People obsess too much over the idea of being "set" at a position. It's just not a real way of operating, everything is always in motion. It's called Not For Long for a reason. And the truth is you don't really need to be set at anything, just have the right pieces together at the right time. Look how "set" the Seahawks D looked a few years ago. They had pieces in place for ten years! But here they are. The Eagles just won with a back up QB.

I don't know how set we are at anything but we have the most talented group in the trenches that we've had in a really long time. I'm for one at excited and hopefully, they are clicking in January.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby MJW » Wed Jun 06, 2018 6:10 am

Doctor wrote:Indeed. People obsess too much over the idea of being "set" at a position. It's just not a real way of operating, everything is always in motion. It's called Not For Long for a reason. And the truth is you don't really need to be set at anything, just have the right pieces together at the right time. Look how "set" the Seahawks D looked a few years ago. They had pieces in place for ten years! But here they are. The Eagles just won with a back up QB.

I don't know how set we are at anything but we have the most talented group in the trenches that we've had in a really long time. I'm for one at excited and hopefully, they are clicking in January.


Yep. Obviously some needs are more glaring than others, but needs change rapidly and violently in this league. I don't really believe in drafting for need, OR drafting from a generic "best player available" sense. All positions are not created equally. The defensive line? Next to QB, the most important spot on the roster. Also the one that needs the most depth. So...draft defensive linemen, early and often. I said this elsewhere, but nobody ever regrets loading up the defensive line.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby real bucs fan » Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:32 am

Jason Licht appears to have the same philosophy as I do, with him consistantly going BPA in Round 1, and then targeting needs on Day 2 with players you've identified. Day 3 you then revert back to BPA as I just try to find capable players.
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Re: Vita Vea

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:49 am

real bucs fan wrote:Jason Licht appears to have the same philosophy as I do, with him consistantly going BPA in Round 1, and then targeting needs on Day 2 with players you've identified. Day 3 you then revert back to BPA as I just try to find capable players.

Keep in mind that he uses free agency to go after team needs which allows him to largely go BPA in the draft. This might be the year that it finally works.

If it does, what he does next spring could be very difficult to predict.
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