The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Cheb » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:41 am

mdb1958 wrote:Not that you want to do it!

If we did jet Chubb at 7, what scenario could you come up with that would allow us to get one of Buffalo's 1st's so we could get Davenport too. Do we have anybody on our roster that could be paired with a first next year?


The last thing we should do is trade away a player and a first round pick to select a high-risk developmental defensive end in Davenport, a guy who I think has bust written all over him. Especially if the stars align and we end up getting Bradley Chubb, that would be a colossal mistake.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Brazen331 » Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:52 pm

Alpha wrote:
Brazen331 wrote:At first, I just dismissed it out of hand as I see no evidence that we actually would take him at 7.


I'm just curious...

What evidence do you have as to whom we would take at #7?

I mean...you clearly have some "inside skinny" as to whom we would take...right?

Oh...my bad. You're just opining and talking out of your ass.

There is MASSIVE reason to take Nelson, if he falls to us.

The interwebz is an awesome thing...where dudes like Brazen can just talk ****...without ANY kind of proof/evidence/logic to back up what they're saying.

Brazen...go take your bush league bullshit somewhere else.


It’s 2:44 AM and Alpha is drunk posting again. I guess the rest of my post was too blurry for his wasted ass to read.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Naismith » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:55 pm

My top choice is for the Bucs to trade back and acquire more picks but I think Nelson is my top player for the Bucs in the draft, even if Chubb is on board. I don't expect the Bucs to take him over Chubb if available, but I think he's the best player at the top of the draft.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:22 am

Cheb wrote:
mdb1958 wrote:Not that you want to do it!

If we did jet Chubb at 7, what scenario could you come up with that would allow us to get one of Buffalo's 1st's so we could get Davenport too. Do we have anybody on our roster that could be paired with a first next year?


The last thing we should do is trade away a player and a first round pick to select a high-risk developmental defensive end in Davenport, a guy who I think has bust written all over him. Especially if the stars align and we end up getting Bradley Chubb, that would be a colossal mistake.



You must not think the defensive ends in this draft dont have much to offer for us. I think farther back in the draft some of the other DE's will be able to find some success with their teams, some may even surprise and put it all together. I'd rather look at it a different way (going after Davenport), if we find a trade partner and then feel the draft we put together is going to have us picking late next year it would mitigate the risk involved. Of course you could be right and one of the highest tanked DE's could be a bust.

I was thinking Chubb would go after the right tackles and Davenport would learn and get snaps at going after the QB from the blindside. I think Dorance Armstrong could have a good NFL career too.

I think I'll let this idea simmer until after the combine to see what the braintrusts are thinking then.


Cheb, do you have the link saying Jaylon Ferguson is going back to school? If you do, thanks in advance.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby MJW » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:28 am

Chubb is the only prospect in this draft I'm legit excited about (in the first round), but I don't want to trade up for him or anyone else.

This is a bad roster, right here. Huge holes on both lines. Basically a teardown at cornerback, and completely a teardown at running back. We need to be maximizing value here.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:42 am

Naismith wrote:My top choice is for the Bucs to trade back and acquire more picks but I think Nelson is my top player for the Bucs in the draft, even if Chubb is on board. I don't expect the Bucs to take him over Chubb if available, but I think he's the best player at the top of the draft.


I think it was you that said (more or less) your direction goes by how the draft plays out. I like Nelson as a pick for us but I do wish things would play out differently. It would be great if this defense would jump straight to bad azz, and knowing its going to get even better.

Then, I wonder. Does this team ever think about going 3-4?

Have they already identified the perfect pairing for Gerald?

Does drafting Nelson make him the highest paid G in four years and can you improve your offensive line so much that you can't hardly afford to keep them.

Can our CB's ever excel in press and off man coverage, do we even try to get that way?

Will Winston struggle with offensive subtractions and additions?
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:32 am

MJW wrote:Chubb is the only prospect in this draft I'm legit excited about (in the first round), but I don't want to trade up for him or anyone else.

This is a bad roster, right here. Huge holes on both lines. Basically a teardown at cornerback, and completely a teardown at running back. We need to be maximizing value here.

I think he's the only guy you're excited about because your viewing edge as the big issue needing fixing. And you're right. But beyond edge, there are some great prospects in this draft at the top who would fill in at some of those other positions you mentioned. We are going to get a great player at a position of need at 7. I don't see how we don't. Might not be that elusive edge, but a great player at a position of need regardless.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:41 am

1st - Nelson
2nd - Settle
3rd - Josh Sweat/Andrew Brown
4th - RB or CB
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Super K » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:03 pm

Unless you're interested in winning some bench press competitions, adding Josh Sweat does nothing for us and is a wasted pick...ESPECIALLY in round 3..I'd flip the **** out..
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:09 pm

Super K wrote:Unless you're interested in winning some bench press competitions, adding Josh Sweat does nothing for us and is a wasted pick...ESPECIALLY in round 3..I'd flip the **** out..


I like his upside and think he's a good risk/reward pick in round 3. He's battled injuries and needs some good coaching, but he has tools/traits I like. I think his best football is ahead of him if he finds the right situation.

I get you're an FSU guy and paid closer attention to him as a fan. If his production matched his talent he's be a top 20 pick imo.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:48 pm

Kiper released his top 25 big board. The top 10 features the big 4 (Barkley, Fitz, Chubb, and Nelson) followed by 4 QBs (Allen, Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield) and 2 LBs (Smith, Edmunds).
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Feb 16, 2018 4:17 pm

Cheb, do you have the link saying Jaylon Ferguson is going back to school? If you do, thanks in advance.



Does anyone have this info?
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Cheb » Fri Feb 16, 2018 4:26 pm

mdb1958 wrote:
Cheb, do you have the link saying Jaylon Ferguson is going back to school? If you do, thanks in advance.



Does anyone have this info?


"Though Louisiana Tech loses all-conference senior cornerback Secdrick Cooper, Bulldogs defensive lineman Jaylon Ferguson decided against the NFL and will stay for his senior season." - http://faufocus.blog.palmbeachpost.com/ ... y-players/
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby I Are Serious Poster » Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:32 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
Super K wrote:Unless you're interested in winning some bench press competitions, adding Josh Sweat does nothing for us and is a wasted pick...ESPECIALLY in round 3..I'd flip the **** out..


I like his upside and think he's a good risk/reward pick in round 3. He's battled injuries and needs some good coaching, but he has tools/traits I like. I think his best football is ahead of him if he finds the right situation.

I get you're an FSU guy and paid closer attention to him as a fan. If his production matched his talent he's be a top 20 pick imo.


What?

He didn't battle injuries; he battled injury, sustained his senior season of high school that he never recovered from. I wish him well, but unless we can faith heal that knee of his he is never going to be the guy he could have been. He's had years to recover; he is what he is now.

Also, he played under a largely inept defensive coordinator, but Brad Lawing has an impeccable track record as a DE coach and Odell was there for advice if he needed it.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Doctor » Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:16 pm

MJW wrote:Chubb is the only prospect in this draft I'm legit excited about (in the first round), but I don't want to trade up for him or anyone else.

This is a bad roster, right here. Huge holes on both lines. Basically a teardown at cornerback, and completely a teardown at running back. We need to be maximizing value here.

You're nuts.

Teardown? You're kidding. I get that we don't have big names at CB, but we also just lost out best one to FA, we'll likely be signing another, but that would be it. No teardown job. You tossing away guys like VH3 and Ryan Smith to the trash already after just two season because you want shiny new toys is exactly the wrong kind of thinking.

As for RB, it's also not a teardown becasue there's just no one there! It's empty!

Now if you wanted to call the DL a tear down job, I could see that argument made.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sat Feb 17, 2018 8:10 pm

This wouldnt surprise me, now they are both getting picked on this Sim!!!


1: R1P1
QB JOSH ROSEN
CLEVELAND BROWNS

2: R1P2
QB BAKER MAYFIELD
NEW YORK GIANTS

3: R1P3
EDGE BRADLEY CHUBB
INDIANAPOLIS COLTS

4: R1P4
RB SAQUON BARKLEY
CLEVELAND BROWNS

5: R1P5
OT ORLANDO BROWN
DENVER BRONCOS

6: R1P6
EDGE MARCUS DAVENPORT
NEW YORK JETS
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Alpha » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:28 am

mdb1958 wrote:This wouldnt surprise me, now they are both getting picked on this Sim!!!


1: R1P1
QB JOSH ROSEN
CLEVELAND BROWNS

2: R1P2
QB BAKER MAYFIELD
NEW YORK GIANTS

3: R1P3
EDGE BRADLEY CHUBB
INDIANAPOLIS COLTS

4: R1P4
RB SAQUON BARKLEY
CLEVELAND BROWNS

5: R1P5
OT ORLANDO BROWN
DENVER BRONCOS

6: R1P6
EDGE MARCUS DAVENPORT
NEW YORK JETS


LMAO! Why on earth would Brown...a CLEARLY inferior prospect, be taken before Nelson!?

Could it happen? Sure. Anything COULD happen...but you people are getting out of hand.

Even BEFORE the Underwear Olympics...the board is shaping up pretty clearly:

Barkley. Top offensive prospect.
Chubb. Best defensive prospect
Nelson. 2nd best offensive prospect
Fitzpatrick. 2nd best defensive prospect.

Everything is gonna get blurred for the next couple of months...but this is the reality.

The only question is how many QB's go early. Is it 2? 3? 4?

That tells us who we will be taking...
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:55 am

Alpha these Sims are done with algorithms, I think.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

An algorithm is, essentially, a brainless way of doing clever things. It is a set of precise steps that need no great mental effort to follow but which, if obeyed exactly and mechanically, will lead to some desirable outcome. Long division and column addition are examples that everyone is familiar with—if you follow the procedure, you are guaranteed to get the right answer. So is the strategy, rediscovered thousands of times every year by schoolchildren bored with learning mathematical algorithms, for playing a perfect game of noughts and crosses. The brainlessness is key: each step should be as simple and as free from ambiguity as possible. Cooking recipes and driving directions are algorithms of a sort. But instructions like “stew the meat until tender” or “it’s a few miles down the road” are too vague to follow without at least some interpretation.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:13 pm

As much as we need a RB, I think the Bucs should draft Dline early and often. If Nelson falls into out laps at 7th overall we should draft him instead of reaching for Davenport or Vea, but rounds 2-4 need to be Dlinemen imo.

This team needs an infusion of talent and youth in the trenches ASAP!
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:16 pm

I think you get the guard, the corner, and the defensive tackle in free agency. You get the running back and the defensive end in the draft, since you generally have to draft those positions.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:24 pm

real bucs fan wrote:I think you get the guard, the corner, and the defensive tackle in free agency. You get the running back and the defensive end in the draft, since you generally have to draft those positions.


I'm fine with that and agree you have to draft Dlinemen since teams rarley let quality ones out of the building before they turn 30.

But even if we sign a Guard in FA (say Norwell) I'd still wouldn't pass on Nelson if he's there at 7 (assuming Chub and Barkley are off the board already). Nelson has a higher ceiling and higher floor than almost anyone in the draft imo. We can always cut Sweezy with no penalty.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:42 pm

If we sign Norwell, and Chubb/Barkley are off the board, i think you just go ahead and draft the highest rated defender left- likely Minkah Fitzpatrick. Drafting Nelson only to cut Sweezy and have Nelson play the other side of center isn't a good use of resources IMO.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:42 pm

I fixed the Dline with the latest Fanspeak BB update. They can't all bust can they?

1: R1P7 EDGE BRADLEY CHUBB NORTH CAROLINA STATE
2: R2P6 DL TAVEN BRYAN FLORIDA
3: R3P5 EDGE ARDEN KEY LSU
4: R4P8 DL TIM SETTLE VIRGINIA TECH
5: R5P7 RB BO SCARBROUGH ALABAMA
6: R6P6 G WYATT TELLER VIRGINIA TECH
7: R6P28 RB PHILLIP LINDSAY COLORADO
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby DreadNaught » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:46 pm

real bucs fan wrote:If we sign Norwell, and Chubb/Barkley are off the board, i think you just go ahead and draft the highest rated defender left- likely Minkah Fitzpatrick. Drafting Nelson only to cut Sweezy and have Nelson play the other side of center isn't a good use of resources IMO.


And if Minkah is off the board also? I get he argument for Minkah over Nelson, not sure I agree, buts it's a good choice either way imo. My point was more don't pass on Nelson for the likes of a riskier player like Davenport/Key, or a guy like Vea that won't offer much pass rush. Not that I don't think Vea is a stud, but drafting a DT at 7 that could likely be a 2-down player is something I would not prefer over a prospect like Nelson who will be a stud starting day 1.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Super K » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:07 pm

I don't think Vea is a 2 down player...I think he could be a damn terror at NT on passing downs pushing the pocket and, at the very least, getting this big ol arms up in passing lanes...
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:26 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:If we sign Norwell, and Chubb/Barkley are off the board, i think you just go ahead and draft the highest rated defender left- likely Minkah Fitzpatrick. Drafting Nelson only to cut Sweezy and have Nelson play the other side of center isn't a good use of resources IMO.


And if Minkah is off the board also? I get he argument for Minkah over Nelson, not sure I agree, buts it's a good choice either way imo. My point was more don't pass on Nelson for the likes of a riskier player like Davenport/Key, or a guy like Vea that won't offer much pass rush. Not that I don't think Vea is a stud, but drafting a DT at 7 that could likely be a 2-down player is something I would not prefer over a prospect like Nelson who will be a stud starting day 1.

We'll see how things play out post combine and FA, but I think Minkah falls to us. Unless the Browns take him in which case Barkley falls to us, unless the Colts take Barkley and Chubb fall to us :P
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby MJW » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:50 am

real bucs fan wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:
And if Minkah is off the board also? I get he argument for Minkah over Nelson, not sure I agree, buts it's a good choice either way imo. My point was more don't pass on Nelson for the likes of a riskier player like Davenport/Key, or a guy like Vea that won't offer much pass rush. Not that I don't think Vea is a stud, but drafting a DT at 7 that could likely be a 2-down player is something I would not prefer over a prospect like Nelson who will be a stud starting day 1.

We'll see how things play out post combine and FA, but I think Minkah falls to us. Unless the Browns take him in which case Barkley falls to us, unless the Colts take Barkley and Chubb fall to us :P


For some reason, the Colts aren't talked about nearly enough as a trade-back team. They might have the worst 53 in the league. I love Chubb, and he'd be a good fit for them, but if they can get value they probably will.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby real bucs fan » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:28 am

MJW wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:We'll see how things play out post combine and FA, but I think Minkah falls to us. Unless the Browns take him in which case Barkley falls to us, unless the Colts take Barkley and Chubb fall to us :P


For some reason, the Colts aren't talked about nearly enough as a trade-back team. They might have the worst 53 in the league. I love Chubb, and he'd be a good fit for them, but if they can get value they probably will.

We'll see. As we know as well as anyone, getting that dominant 4-3 edge defender is nearly impossible. If you have the chance to get one like the Colts do, you take him. They can then just try and address OL, LB, and CB in FA and on Day 2.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Brazen331 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:41 pm

MJW wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:We'll see how things play out post combine and FA, but I think Minkah falls to us. Unless the Browns take him in which case Barkley falls to us, unless the Colts take Barkley and Chubb fall to us :P


For some reason, the Colts aren't talked about nearly enough as a trade-back team. They might have the worst 53 in the league. I love Chubb, and he'd be a good fit for them, but if they can get value they probably will.


Colts are a premium trade-back team. I would not be surprised at all to see QBs go 1-2-3, especially if someone is brave enough to select Mayfield top 2.
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Re: The real 2018 Tampa Bay Buccaneer Draft discussion

Postby Naismith » Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:30 pm

Is Chubb considered a dominant pass rushing DE candidate? I hadn't seen that kind of excitement about him, though I don't watch college football and haven't formed my own opinion on him yet.
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