Just for boredom relief in the off season

Team Discussions regarding games, players, coaches, or anything else related to Buccaneer Football.
post

Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Babeinbucland » Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:40 pm

Lets say by some miracle- Fitzgerald goes 3-0. Jamesis comes off of suspension - Go with him? Stay with the “hot hand”? What say you and why?
User avatar
Babeinbucland
 
Posts: 4064
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:24 pm
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 102 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Bootz2004 » Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:47 pm

You can do better than this.
User avatar
Bootz2004
 
Posts: 21965
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:17 pm
Has thanked: 101 times
Been thanked: 464 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Rocker » Mon Jun 25, 2018 9:54 pm

If, be some unforeseen miracle, we started 3-0 with Fitzpatrick under center, Winston starts as soon as he’s available.

He’s the better QB.


Edit: It would take the aforementioned miracle(s) to start 3-0.
Image
User avatar
Rocker
 
Posts: 3338
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:23 am
Location: Upper deck of the Old Sombrero
Has thanked: 195 times
Been thanked: 180 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby terrytate » Mon Jun 25, 2018 9:58 pm

Do we still have the rights to Jake Plummer?
User avatar
terrytate
 
Posts: 2188
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:49 am
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 89 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Caradoc » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:25 pm

Buy a vibrator.
Caradoc
 
Posts: 4086
Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:30 pm
Has thanked: 197 times
Been thanked: 122 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Rocker » Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:15 pm

Caradoc wrote:I’m a rude piece of ****.


FIFY
Image
User avatar
Rocker
 
Posts: 3338
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:23 am
Location: Upper deck of the Old Sombrero
Has thanked: 195 times
Been thanked: 180 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Babeinbucland » Tue Jun 26, 2018 2:16 am

Bootz2004 wrote:You can do better than this.

Link?
User avatar
Babeinbucland
 
Posts: 4064
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:24 pm
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 102 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Onthebrink » Tue Jun 26, 2018 8:15 pm

I asked this question already almost verbatim. I would stick with the hot hand if he could perform this miracle. Even though he really isn't a very good QB. If it did happen though he would have more wins in six starts then Jamies did all of last year by double. Probably won't happen though. Not like most people here are objective. There's no middle ground. Say something negative about Jamies and you hate him. Something positive and you suck his ****.
Onthebrink
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 11:06 am
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Doctor » Tue Jun 26, 2018 8:31 pm

If they were close games we go with Winston. But if they were blow outs and Fitz was sporting a 10:1 TD:INT ratio, you can't sit that.
Image
User avatar
Doctor
 
Posts: 5045
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2015 6:54 pm
Location: Out of the Office. Will return next Fall.
Has thanked: 211 times
Been thanked: 149 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Babeinbucland » Tue Jun 26, 2018 8:52 pm

Doctor wrote:If they were close games we go with Winston. But if they were blow outs and Fitz was sporting a 10:1 TD:INT ratio, you can't sit that.

Excellent points all
User avatar
Babeinbucland
 
Posts: 4064
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:24 pm
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 102 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:20 pm

Im not sure about the sanctimonious negativity with this question ... it seems as good / as pointless as any question we have on these boards.


3-0 against the schedule the Bucs have, I stick with the hot hand.
Zarniwoop
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:23 pm
Has thanked: 204 times
Been thanked: 251 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Crocaneers » Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:40 pm

Please see Scott Mitchell for any questions
Image
User avatar
Crocaneers
 
Posts: 2319
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:44 am
Location: Gatorland (at least on the weekends )
Has thanked: 369 times
Been thanked: 210 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Babeinbucland » Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:48 pm

Crocaneers wrote:Please see Scott Mitchell for any questions

Hey sweetie, hope you are doing welll~
User avatar
Babeinbucland
 
Posts: 4064
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:24 pm
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 102 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Nano » Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:20 am

Considering with Winston we probably lose all 3(and likely blowouts), you have to stick with Fitz. Unless we barely win each game with Fitz looking like total ****, you stick with the hot hand.
User avatar
Nano
 
Posts: 7103
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 6:30 pm
Location: Somewhere above Tampa
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 248 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:05 am

Zarniwoop wrote:Im not sure about the sanctimonious negativity with this question ... it seems as good / as pointless as any question we have on these boards.


3-0 against the schedule the Bucs have, I stick with the hot hand.


yeah I have to agree with this. and with DO stick with him, give him AT LEAST 2 losses before we switch back, IMO
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Caradoc » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:54 pm

People are actually taking this seriously?

Jameis plays, Fitz sitz. There is no world remotely connected to our reality where the answer is different.
Caradoc
 
Posts: 4086
Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:30 pm
Has thanked: 197 times
Been thanked: 122 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 9:02 pm

Babeinbucland wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:You can do better than this.

Link?


I guess I was wrong. You are an idiot then.
User avatar
Bootz2004
 
Posts: 21965
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:17 pm
Has thanked: 101 times
Been thanked: 464 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:02 am

Bootz2004 wrote:
Babeinbucland wrote:Link?


I guess I was wrong. You are an idiot then.


Lmao you’re too easy man
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby acmillis » Thu Jun 28, 2018 10:34 am

I'm a Jameis pessimist, but there is no way he isn't the starter when healthy.
acmillis
 
Posts: 1079
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 3:05 pm
Has thanked: 13 times
Been thanked: 33 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Jun 28, 2018 10:47 am

Zarniwoop wrote:3-0 against the schedule the Bucs have, I stick with the hot hand.


Probably this^^^^

But it would depend on how Fitz is playing and how we won those games. If we won with great defense and running ball with Fitz just not blowing the game with turnovers (but still looking shaky) than I might still switch back to Jameis. But if we're 3-0 and Fitz has the 'hot hand' than absolutely stay with him.

It would be tough call, but for as much as I like and supported Jameis he hasn't entrenched himself to the point his starting spot is untouchable. It was his own behavior that forced him to sit out these games provide this opportunity for Fitz.

In this scenario Fitz would be 5-1 as the Bucs starting QB with Winston being just 3-10 in that same time span dating back to the start of last season. That can't be ignored.

Remember that Licht and Koetter have their job on the line and it's MUST WIN this year regardless of who is out there. No excuses like last season will be acceptable imo. So if we start 3-0 I'd have a tough time thinking Licht/Koetter would be so willing to just hand the ball back to Winston.
Image
User avatar
DreadNaught
 
Posts: 11734
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 9:18 am
Has thanked: 481 times
Been thanked: 506 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:11 am

DreadNaught wrote:
Zarniwoop wrote:3-0 against the schedule the Bucs have, I stick with the hot hand.


Probably this^^^^

But it would depend on how Fitz is playing and how we won those games. If we won with great defense and running ball with Fitz just not blowing the game with turnovers (but still looking shaky) than I might still switch back to Jameis. But if we're 3-0 and Fitz has the 'hot hand' than absolutely stay with him.

It would be tough call, but for as much as I like and supported Jameis he hasn't entrenched himself to the point his starting spot is untouchable. It was his own behavior that forced him to sit out these games provide this opportunity for Fitz.

In this scenario Fitz would be 5-1 as the Bucs starting QB with Winston being just 3-10 in that same time span dating back to the start of last season. That can't be ignored.

Remember that Licht and Koetter have their job on the line and it's MUST WIN this year regardless of who is out there. No excuses like last season will be acceptable imo. So if we start 3-0 I'd have a tough time thinking Licht/Koetter would be so willing to just hand the ball back to Winston.


Exactly. The part about Licht and Koetter's job is key. If they win without Fitz, Koetter is able to decouple himself from Winston and show the Glazers that he can win with a team without Winston at the helm and that gives the Glazers good reason to see what he can do with a "soft reset" (i.e. moving on from Winston) moving forward. With how shaky Winston has been, you bet your ass he keeps Fitz on the field if he's got "the hot hand". Licht, however, is forever tied to Winston. At the same time though, if Koetter is winning without Winston, a major reason why will be due to the talent Licht has acquired for this team over the past several years.

Riding with a "hot hand" Fitz is THE move for Koetter and Licht if they come out strong with Fitz at the helm this year.
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Cheb » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:19 am

DreadNaught wrote:In this scenario Fitz would be 5-1 as the Bucs starting QB with Winston being just 3-10 in that same time span dating back to the start of last season. That can't be ignored.


There's the crux of the matter. If Fitz starts the season 3-0, then he would have nearly twice Winston's win total in less than half the starts.

If it were up to me to make the decision in this hypothetical, those contrasting starting records would not definitively prove that the team is better off without Winston, but it would provide enough doubt that I would stick with Fitz until either injury or substantial regression forces my hand back to the (alleged) serial sex criminal. Especially if Fitz just swept the hardest opening three games to start the season in the Superbowl era, I would keep him until forced not to.
Image
Cheb
 
Posts: 3530
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:00 pm
Location: West Coast is best coast
Has thanked: 60 times
Been thanked: 314 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Bootz2004 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:51 am

A hot hand is just that. Its not a consistent force. Sticking with Fitz would be an extremely short-sighted decision. Guy has been in the league 16 years now and has 1 or 2 decent seasons. You know what he is already. A 3-0 start likely does not translate into an entire seasons worth of success.

Winston on the other hand has played better in 3 seasons than Fitz has in 16. And he's still getting better. There would be absolutely ZERO benefit to sitting Winston even in the event we go 3-0 without him. Fitzpatrick is not the future.
User avatar
Bootz2004
 
Posts: 21965
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:17 pm
Has thanked: 101 times
Been thanked: 464 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:06 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:A hot hand is just that. Its not a consistent force. Sticking with Fitz would be an extremely short-sighted decision. Guy has been in the league 16 years now and has 1 or 2 decent seasons. You know what he is already. A 3-0 start likely does not translate into an entire seasons worth of success.

Winston on the other hand has played better in 3 seasons than Fitz has in 16. And he's still getting better. There would be absolutely ZERO benefit to sitting Winston even in the event we go 3-0 without him. Fitzpatrick is not the future.


I don't disagree on those points, but in this hypothetical scenario and in the context of Winston's off field issues coupled with the hot seat coaching and FO staff will be on this season I don't see them automatically handing the ball to Winston if we're 3-0 w/ Fitz.

But in reality the Bucs won't start 3-0, your points are valid and Winston will start when he returns from suspension.
Image
User avatar
DreadNaught
 
Posts: 11734
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 9:18 am
Has thanked: 481 times
Been thanked: 506 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:08 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:A hot hand is just that. Its not a consistent force. Sticking with Fitz would be an extremely short-sighted decision. Guy has been in the league 16 years now and has 1 or 2 decent seasons. You know what he is already. A 3-0 start likely does not translate into an entire seasons worth of success.

Winston on the other hand has played better in 3 seasons than Fitz has in 16. And he's still getting better. There would be absolutely ZERO benefit to sitting Winston even in the event we go 3-0 without him. Fitzpatrick is not the future.


That's the point. If you already know who Fitz is - a B+ backup - and you're able to show that you can coach the team to victories with a guy like THAT, why not decouple your career from an inconsistent bozo who can't keep his name out of the press
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Bootz2004 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:47 pm

beardmcdoug wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:A hot hand is just that. Its not a consistent force. Sticking with Fitz would be an extremely short-sighted decision. Guy has been in the league 16 years now and has 1 or 2 decent seasons. You know what he is already. A 3-0 start likely does not translate into an entire seasons worth of success.

Winston on the other hand has played better in 3 seasons than Fitz has in 16. And he's still getting better. There would be absolutely ZERO benefit to sitting Winston even in the event we go 3-0 without him. Fitzpatrick is not the future.


That's the point. If you already know who Fitz is - a B+ backup - and you're able to show that you can coach the team to victories with a guy like THAT, why not decouple your career from an inconsistent bozo who can't keep his name out of the press


3 wins is your idea of coaching victories? Uh huh.

Okay let's say for the purposes of this exercise we go 3-0 and stick with Fitz. Fitz does something similar to what he did with the Jets when they went 10-6, 31 TDs, 16 INTs, 4000 yards, just under 60% completion. Let's say we end up 12-4 and make it to the divisional round and lose. Dirk & Licht get contract extensions. All is well going into 2019. Or is it?

Your now starting QB is 37. Are you sticking with him again and hoping he can continue his "hot streak" at age 37? If so you'll have to pay the man and pay him well. If not, then what? You've alienated your now 25 year old former #1 overall pick. His option for $20mil isn't guaranteed so you'll likely have to cut him. So what's next? Drafting a QB? Making it to the divisional round puts that draft pick in the high 20s. Are you hoping a good QB falls that late? Money will be scarce so signing a top QB won't be an option.

Point is sitting Winston would have far more damaging ramifications than you realize. The Jets counted on Fitz in 2016 and he did well in 2015. He rewarded them with 12 TDs and 17 INTs the next season and a losing record. B+ backup does not equal B+ starting QB.
User avatar
Bootz2004
 
Posts: 21965
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:17 pm
Has thanked: 101 times
Been thanked: 464 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Buc2 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:54 pm

Put this in the wrong thread (too many Winston threads!). Deleted it and posting it here instead.

All hypothetical bullshit aside, while I didn't want us to draft a QB with that #1 overall pick in 2015 (I was in the trade back camp), we did. So I'll be damned if I'm ready to give up on a promising, and very talented, 24 year old QB with maturity issues that still has a year plus an option year left on his contract to boot.

I watched Fitz play last year. Sorry. No thanks. I don't give a **** what he does this September. Even if he gets lucky and wins all 3 games, it's still only 3 games of a long career filled with proven mediocrity. Like it or not, I go with the young gun and do what I have to do to try and make his immature ass grow the **** up. In light of the present circumstances this young man now finds himself embroiled in, perhaps he already has.

So... No to Fitz. No to Griffin. That's where I'm at right now. Dude hasn't been found guilty or prosecuted for anything and people want him gone because of "feelings"? Well, **** your "feelings". Sorry, but this is football. Not a church choir.
Image
Don't tread on me
User avatar
Buc2
 
Posts: 9976
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 2:16 pm
Location: America
Has thanked: 850 times
Been thanked: 330 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:56 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
beardmcdoug wrote:
That's the point. If you already know who Fitz is - a B+ backup - and you're able to show that you can coach the team to victories with a guy like THAT, why not decouple your career from an inconsistent bozo who can't keep his name out of the press


3 wins is your idea of coaching victories? Uh huh.

Okay let's say for the purposes of this exercise we go 3-0 and stick with Fitz. Fitz does something similar to what he did with the Jets when they went 10-6, 31 TDs, 16 INTs, 4000 yards, just under 60% completion. Let's say we end up 12-4 and make it to the divisional round and lose. Dirk & Licht get contract extensions. All is well going into 2019. Or is it?

Your now starting QB is 37. Are you sticking with him again and hoping he can continue his "hot streak" at age 37? If so you'll have to pay the man and pay him well. If not, then what? You've alienated your now 25 year old former #1 overall pick. His option for $20mil isn't guaranteed so you'll likely have to cut him. So what's next? Drafting a QB? Making it to the divisional round puts that draft pick in the high 20s. Are you hoping a good QB falls that late? Money will be scarce so signing a top QB won't be an option.

Point is sitting Winston would have far more damaging ramifications than you realize. The Jets counted on Fitz in 2016 and he did well in 2015. He rewarded them with 12 TDs and 17 INTs the next season and a losing record. B+ backup does not equal B+ starting QB.


Yeah, if Fitz puts up that kind of year, 31 TDs, 14 Int's, 4000 yards, yeah you start him going into next year - why wouldn't you? And at the same time, you trade Winston to a team that thinks "he just needs a change of scenery", you trade up and draft a QB that you think can be the future that offseason (like the bears and chiefs did recently), or you sign a FA QB like the Vikings did, and you ride out in a different direction. I'm not counting on Fitz for anything more than the rest of this year in this scenario - but of all scenarios, where he balls out that hard, there's plenty of options moving forward, and that really isn't the doom and gloom scenario you're trying to paint it as. I'm just talking about, functionally, there IS a play to be made there by Koetter/Licht if they're at all interested (they are) in keeping their jobs for the relative long-term. And that might involve going with Fitz over Winston if Fitz is performing well enough and we're rackin W's

again, though, this is completely hypothetical and not something necessarily I imagine happening
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby beardmcdoug » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:00 pm

Buc2 wrote:Put this in the wrong thread (too many Winston threads!). Deleted it and posting it here instead.

All hypothetical bullshit aside, while I didn't want us to draft a QB with that #1 overall pick in 2015 (I was in the trade back camp), we did. So I'll be damned if I'm ready to give up on a promising, and very talented, 24 year old QB with maturity issues that still has a year plus an option year left on his contract to boot.

I watched Fitz play last year. Sorry. No thanks. I don't give a **** what he does this September. Even if he gets lucky and wins all 3 games, it's still only 3 games of a long career filled with proven mediocrity. Like it or not, I go with the young gun and do what I have to do to try and make his immature ass grow the **** up. In light of the present circumstances this young man now finds himself embroiled in, perhaps he already has.

So... No to Fitz. No to Griffin. That's where I'm at right now. Dude hasn't been found guilty or prosecuted for anything and people want him gone because of "feelings"? Well, **** your "feelings". Sorry, but this is football. Not a church choir.


yeah, and I don't even really disagree with this either. Just imagining maybe what I would do if I were in Koetter/Licht's situation
User avatar
beardmcdoug
 
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:30 pm
Has thanked: 304 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Just for boredom relief in the off season

Postby Bootz2004 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:26 pm

beardmcdoug wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
3 wins is your idea of coaching victories? Uh huh.

Okay let's say for the purposes of this exercise we go 3-0 and stick with Fitz. Fitz does something similar to what he did with the Jets when they went 10-6, 31 TDs, 16 INTs, 4000 yards, just under 60% completion. Let's say we end up 12-4 and make it to the divisional round and lose. Dirk & Licht get contract extensions. All is well going into 2019. Or is it?

Your now starting QB is 37. Are you sticking with him again and hoping he can continue his "hot streak" at age 37? If so you'll have to pay the man and pay him well. If not, then what? You've alienated your now 25 year old former #1 overall pick. His option for $20mil isn't guaranteed so you'll likely have to cut him. So what's next? Drafting a QB? Making it to the divisional round puts that draft pick in the high 20s. Are you hoping a good QB falls that late? Money will be scarce so signing a top QB won't be an option.

Point is sitting Winston would have far more damaging ramifications than you realize. The Jets counted on Fitz in 2016 and he did well in 2015. He rewarded them with 12 TDs and 17 INTs the next season and a losing record. B+ backup does not equal B+ starting QB.


Yeah, if Fitz puts up that kind of year, 31 TDs, 14 Int's, 4000 yards, yeah you start him going into next year - why wouldn't you? And at the same time, you trade Winston to a team that thinks "he just needs a change of scenery", you trade up and draft a QB that you think can be the future that offseason (like the bears and chiefs did recently), or you sign a FA QB like the Vikings did, and you ride out in a different direction. I'm not counting on Fitz for anything more than the rest of this year in this scenario - but of all scenarios, where he balls out that hard, there's plenty of options moving forward, and that really isn't the doom and gloom scenario you're trying to paint it as. I'm just talking about, functionally, there IS a play to be made there by Koetter/Licht if they're at all interested (they are) in keeping their jobs for the relative long-term. And that might involve going with Fitz over Winston if Fitz is performing well enough and we're rackin W's

again, though, this is completely hypothetical and not something necessarily I imagine happening


The reason most other teams wouldn't go into the year with a 37 year old journeyman as their starting QB. You don't know what you're going to get. The very next year the guy threw 5 more picks than he did TDs. He's not a good QB and everyone knows this. What team is going to trade for a guy they KNOW the Bucs would be cutting? Not 1. Especially when that trade would also come with an expensive contract. Draft capital is already lowered as we only have 6 picks in this draft. Plus we wouldn't be able to continue to address other needs. No good comes out of your scenario.
User avatar
Bootz2004
 
Posts: 21965
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:17 pm
Has thanked: 101 times
Been thanked: 464 times

Next

post

Return to Team Discussions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Cheb, Cream Sickle, Rocker, Zarniwoop and 19 guests