sanka wrote:He plays in a good system...he has failed at Rams.
MJW wrote:sanka wrote:He plays in a good system...he has failed at Rams.
I agree with Sanka for the most part. He's shown flashes throughout his career, but he's fool's gold. He's as good as his play-caller and his surrounding talent.
Caradoc wrote:MJW wrote:
I agree with Sanka for the most part. He's shown flashes throughout his career, but he's fool's gold. He's as good as his play-caller and his surrounding talent.
Sounds like what people say about Kirk Cousins.
Doctor wrote:How do you trade the SB MVP. That's tough. But really, he failed on the Rams....
Remember Warner was a failed journeyman between his two SBs.
Doctor wrote:How do you trade the SB MVP. That's tough. But really, he failed on the Rams....
Remember Warner was a failed journeyman between his two SBs.
MJW wrote:Doctor wrote:How do you trade the SB MVP. That's tough. But really, he failed on the Rams....
Remember Warner was a failed journeyman between his two SBs.
Foles looked great when he was running an offense the NFL had never seen before and didn't know how to defend, with Chip Kelly that first year.
He's looked great for all of two months in Philly, behind a great line, with top tier skill position talent, and a great playcaller.
When he hasn't had those luxuries, like after the NFL caught up to Kelly's scheme, or when he was in St. Louis, he's looked like a guy. He's been under 56.5% completed two of the last three years. Three different teams have given up on him or not bothered to re-sign him.
Somebody may be imprisoned by the moment (to paraphrase our friend Bootz) and give a high pick for him. It happens. But unless they're going to give him great protection, three excellent receivers, a great tight end, three great backs, and a great OC...it would be a mistake. Maybe not a Brock Osweiler mistake. But probably a Mike Glennon mistake.
Bootz2004 wrote:MJW wrote:
Foles looked great when he was running an offense the NFL had never seen before and didn't know how to defend, with Chip Kelly that first year.
He's looked great for all of two months in Philly, behind a great line, with top tier skill position talent, and a great playcaller.
When he hasn't had those luxuries, like after the NFL caught up to Kelly's scheme, or when he was in St. Louis, he's looked like a guy. He's been under 56.5% completed two of the last three years. Three different teams have given up on him or not bothered to re-sign him.
Somebody may be imprisoned by the moment (to paraphrase our friend Bootz) and give a high pick for him. It happens. But unless they're going to give him great protection, three excellent receivers, a great tight end, three great backs, and a great OC...it would be a mistake. Maybe not a Brock Osweiler mistake. But probably a Mike Glennon mistake.
Interestingly(or not) you made similar points about Cousins not having a great receiving core this year.
I wouldn't call the Eagles skills position all that great. You're talking about a top talent in Zach Ertz, and a bunch of castoffs from other teams. A point you like making all too often, Torrey Smith is on his 3rd team in 4 years and has been meh. Alshon Jeffrey is uber inconsistent. Nelson Algolor was an absolute bust before this year and was still mediocre. At RB you have Legarrette Blount, 31 and also on his 3rd team in 4 years and Jay Ajay, cast out of Miami and didn't play all that well when he got to Philly. There's your All World skills position. No surprise you embellish to try and make a point but hey, when you're desperate..
MJW wrote:Bootz2004 wrote:
Interestingly(or not) you made similar points about Cousins not having a great receiving core this year.
I wouldn't call the Eagles skills position all that great. You're talking about a top talent in Zach Ertz, and a bunch of castoffs from other teams. A point you like making all too often, Torrey Smith is on his 3rd team in 4 years and has been meh. Alshon Jeffrey is uber inconsistent. Nelson Algolor was an absolute bust before this year and was still mediocre. At RB you have Legarrette Blount, 31 and also on his 3rd team in 4 years and Jay Ajay, cast out of Miami and didn't play all that well when he got to Philly. There's your All World skills position. No surprise you embellish to try and make a point but hey, when you're desperate..
Cousins, with arguably the worst skill position help in the league, completed 64.3% of his passes and accounted for 4,300 yards and 31 TDs. And "desperate" is trying to make a case the Eagles don't have excellent skill position talent. The stats, the team's production, and the game we literally just watched all tell us otherwise. Let me know when you escape the moment you're trapped in.
Super K wrote:What Philly has/had are talented players (as they all are at this level, no?) led by a good coach who has an even better scheme/offensive system...
This shouldn't be a pissing match about Foles, but rather a circle jerk regarding Pederson...
Cheb wrote:Super K wrote:What Philly has/had are talented players (as they all are at this level, no?) led by a good coach who has an even better scheme/offensive system...
This shouldn't be a pissing match about Foles, but rather a circle jerk regarding Pederson...
I'd rather not join a circle jerk, but your points are valid. Pederson coached a magnificent game.
MJW wrote:Doctor wrote:How do you trade the SB MVP. That's tough. But really, he failed on the Rams....
Remember Warner was a failed journeyman between his two SBs.
Foles looked great when he was running an offense the NFL had never seen before and didn't know how to defend, with Chip Kelly that first year.
He's looked great for all of two months in Philly, behind a great line, with top tier skill position talent, and a great playcaller.
When he hasn't had those luxuries, like after the NFL caught up to Kelly's scheme, or when he was in St. Louis, he's looked like a guy. He's been under 56.5% completed two of the last three years. Three different teams have given up on him or not bothered to re-sign him.
Somebody may be imprisoned by the moment (to paraphrase our friend Bootz) and give a high pick for him. It happens. But unless they're going to give him great protection, three excellent receivers, a great tight end, three great backs, and a great OC...it would be a mistake. Maybe not a Brock Osweiler mistake. But probably a Mike Glennon mistake.
Doctor wrote:MJW wrote:
Foles looked great when he was running an offense the NFL had never seen before and didn't know how to defend, with Chip Kelly that first year.
He's looked great for all of two months in Philly, behind a great line, with top tier skill position talent, and a great playcaller.
When he hasn't had those luxuries, like after the NFL caught up to Kelly's scheme, or when he was in St. Louis, he's looked like a guy. He's been under 56.5% completed two of the last three years. Three different teams have given up on him or not bothered to re-sign him.
Somebody may be imprisoned by the moment (to paraphrase our friend Bootz) and give a high pick for him. It happens. But unless they're going to give him great protection, three excellent receivers, a great tight end, three great backs, and a great OC...it would be a mistake. Maybe not a Brock Osweiler mistake. But probably a Mike Glennon mistake.
You mean like Arizona?
SIBucsFan wrote:I predict Nick Foles will be traded to the Colts for a second round pick. Still not confident Andrew Luck will be back anytime soon.
Doctor wrote:SIBucsFan wrote:I predict Nick Foles will be traded to the Colts for a second round pick. Still not confident Andrew Luck will be back anytime soon.
Wow, people saying Foles for a 2nd are crazy disrespectful. Carson Palmer, Jay Cutler, Sam Bradford, Trent Green, Drew Bledsoe, Brad Johnson, heck ROB JOHNSON all drew a first round pick in trades.
Jay Feely, Jimmy G, Matt Schaub (a more complicated trade), Kevin Kolb, Matt Cassell- these guys drew a second round pick.
Y'all really saying the Superbowl MVP belong more in the second group than the first? GTFOH.
Doctor wrote:SIBucsFan wrote:I predict Nick Foles will be traded to the Colts for a second round pick. Still not confident Andrew Luck will be back anytime soon.
Wow, people saying Foles for a 2nd are crazy disrespectful. Carson Palmer, Jay Cutler, Sam Bradford, Trent Green, Drew Bledsoe, Brad Johnson, heck ROB JOHNSON all drew a first round pick in trades.
Jay Feely, Jimmy G, Matt Schaub (a more complicated trade), Kevin Kolb, Matt Cassell- these guys drew a second round pick.
Y'all really saying the Superbowl MVP belong more in the second group than the first? GTFOH.
SIBucsFan wrote:Doctor wrote:
Wow, people saying Foles for a 2nd are crazy disrespectful. Carson Palmer, Jay Cutler, Sam Bradford, Trent Green, Drew Bledsoe, Brad Johnson, heck ROB JOHNSON all drew a first round pick in trades.
Jay Feely, Jimmy G, Matt Schaub (a more complicated trade), Kevin Kolb, Matt Cassell- these guys drew a second round pick.
Y'all really saying the Superbowl MVP belong more in the second group than the first? GTFOH.
You take what you can get for a backup QB when a first or second round offer comes along, especially when everyone knows you already have your QBOTF.
Deja Entendu wrote:Doctor wrote:You mean like Arizona?
Or Jacksonville?
I'd hardly call him "fool's gold" at this point. I was doubtful when he looked really good under Reid (before he looked good under Kelly), and I wasn't that surprised he didn't do well in St. Louis. Now with a much larger sample size, I think he's proven he can absolutely thrive and be an upper echelon QB in the league. Sure he benefits from being in a good situation... which QBs don't/haven't?
He flashed real potential under Reid in Philly as essentially a rookie, then under Kelly in a brand new system.
He fizzled some when Kelly started depleting the offense and tape was out on the system.
He sucked on a terrible, and awfully coached, Rams team. Almost quit football, but Reid (who drafted him) talked him into signing with him. Immediately signed with Philly after leaving KC (collusion between Reid and Pederson), and the rest is history.
I'd say a guy who has flashed his potential under three different head coaches, and looked unworldly in the postseason against one of the best defenses in football and the greatest team in the history of the sport is more than "fool's gold." It's not like he Dilfer'd, or even Flacco'd, his way to a championship. He was a gunslinger more than a game manager. The playcalling was great, but the confidence was in him to execute those plays.
I was once a detractor of his, but I believe he's done enough to show he's certainly better than most of the other quarterbacks who have received, and will receive, their payday -- including Kirk Cousins. I don't feel that's reactionary at all.
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