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Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 pm
by PrimeMinister
I'm curious if tonight’s game has swayed opinions here. Simple question: Which young QB would you trade Winston to get? This is a straight up trade with the future of the franchise in mind.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:56 pm
by Doctor
Before I tonight I would've taken Wilson in a heartbeat, after tonight after two heartbeats. Wilson is still way ahead of Winston, but this should definitely shut up some flaky morons out there.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:57 pm
by DreadNaught
These threads are so reactionary. Tonight Winston was who he can be when he's consistent. He was sharp tonight and avoided the mistake(s).

It's been a rough year, but Jameis is the biggest part of whatever the solution will be moving forward.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:58 pm
by PrimeMinister
DreadNaught wrote:These threads are so reactionary. Tonight Winston was who he can be when he's consistent. He was sharp tonight and avoided the mistake(s).

It's been a rough year, but Jameis is the biggest part of whatever the solution will be moving forward.


Of course it’s reactionary. I’m curious if opinions have changed at all.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:58 pm
by Bootz2004
Jameis was my answer before tonight and he's still my answer.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:59 pm
by real bucs fan
It says you can only select one?

I kid, I kid...

Winston balled out tonight. One of the most pleasing plays to me was a 3rd and long, and he was thinking about chucking into trouble but opted to scramble for a short gain. We punted. But kinda felt like he knew to just take what he could get and live another day...

If he can play like that every week, there isn't a young QB I take over him (though that's helped by Wentz and his torn ACL as well I don't consider Wilson an option for this question)...

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:00 am
by Super K
Bootz2004 wrote:Jameis was my answer before tonight and he's still my answer.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:04 am
by PrimeMinister
Bootz2004 wrote:Jameis was my answer before tonight and he's still my answer.


Edited to add “Keep Winston” as an option.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:20 am
by BCULAW
We got to see “good Jameis” in his full glory tonight - blocking for his RB, making plays with his legs, extending plays with great pocket awareness, and throwing with accuracy and precision all over the field. Loved the composure. He has talent to spare. We just need him to be more consistent and I have to think that will come with more experience.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:41 am
by mdb1958
First you must ask yourself --- what would ANY of these other QB's look like --- with our defense?

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:53 am
by Nano
mdb1958 wrote:First you must ask yourself --- what would ANY of these other QB's look like --- with our defense?

Not nearly as good if they constantly have to play catch up and abandon the running game

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 9:39 am
by Stephenip12
Carr.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:00 am
by DreadNaught
PrimeMinister wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:These threads are so reactionary. Tonight Winston was who he can be when he's consistent. He was sharp tonight and avoided the mistake(s).

It's been a rough year, but Jameis is the biggest part of whatever the solution will be moving forward.


Of course it’s reactionary. I’m curious if opinions have changed at all.


Gotcha. I think most fans know what have in Winston, but it was good to see that type of performance for 4 quarters. The Jameis-haters will just stay silent.

I just don't understand how a fan of the Bucs can look at Winston and think "hey, maybe we should draft a QB to replace Jameis", instead of just acknowledging the obvious which is that he's everything we need in a QB and just needs to be more consistent. The kid is still 23yrs old and consistency comes with experience in almost every walk of life including football.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:01 am
by Bootz2004
I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:05 am
by Bootz2004
DreadNaught wrote:
PrimeMinister wrote:
Of course it’s reactionary. I’m curious if opinions have changed at all.


Gotcha. I think most fans know what have in Winston, but it was good to see that type of performance for 4 quarters. The Jameis-haters will just stay silent.

I just don't understand how a fan of the Bucs can look at Winston and think "hey, maybe we should draft a QB to replace Jameis", instead of just acknowledging the obvious which is that he's everything we need in a QB and just needs to be more consistent. The kid is still 23yrs old and consistency comes with experience in almost every walk of life including football.


Kind of nice that even after a loss those haters like BucRican, MJW, Seaman, aren't plastering the board with "see, I told you that's who he is. We'll never get anywhere with him".

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:15 am
by Caradoc
That was definitely the best Jameis has played in a long time. Maybe he was showing off to sell Chucky on the job? :lol:

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:19 am
by NYBF
Bootz2004 wrote:I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.


Just a guess, but:

Luck - hurt all year, who would pick him?
Garropollo, Trubisky - not enough of a sample size to make any real determination
Cousins - free agent, so you wouldn't trade for him.

The rest I've got nothing.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:25 am
by Bootz2004
NYBF wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.


Just a guess, but:

Luck - hurt all year, who would pick him?
Garropollo, Trubisky - not enough of a sample size to make any real determination
Cousins - free agent, so you wouldn't trade for him.

The rest I've got nothing.


Trubisky has a much bigger sample size than Deshaun Watson. 4 more games worth..

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:26 am
by DreadNaught
Not to play 'what if", but I think the Winston injury vs Arizona certainly railroaded his season.

If you take Jameis' stats and remove the game he was injured (Arizona) up to when he returned (vs GB) and look at the 7 games he has been healthy (CHI, MIN, NYG, NE, GB, DET, ATL) this season and he's averaging almost 300yds per game on 65% completions w/ a 14/5 TD/INT ratio.

Extrapolate that 7 game sample size of 'Healthy Jameis' out to a 16 game season and you have almost 4700 yards 32 TDs-11 Ints on 65% completions.

Not bad. Let's see him finish strong these last 2 games.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:27 am
by Deuce
Bootz2004 wrote:I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.


Yeah, makes no sense. I have a hard time calling Russell Wilson a "young" QB anyway, he's 29. He's in his prime years, he still has a good bit left but he isn't "young".

My guess is that any of those other guys aren't good enough to make the list (whether we agree or not).

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:47 am
by The Outsider
This is a stupid poll.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:07 am
by Rocker
The Outsider wrote:This is a stupid poll.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:59 am
by PrimeMinister
DreadNaught wrote:Not to play 'what if", but I think the Winston injury vs Arizona certainly railroaded his season.

If you take Jameis' stats and remove the game he was injured (Arizona) up to when he returned (vs GB) and look at the 7 games he has been healthy (CHI, MIN, NYG, NE, GB, DET, ATL) this season and he's averaging almost 300yds per game on 65% completions w/ a 14/5 TD/INT ratio.

Extrapolate that 7 game sample size of 'Healthy Jameis' out to a 16 game season and you have almost 4700 yards 32 TDs-11 Ints on 65% completions.

Not bad. Let's see him finish strong these last 2 games.


I think the “healthy Jameis” narrative will take hold if Jameis plays well these last two games. That is a narrative fans could buy this offseason. Also if the Glazers are considering firing Koetter having “healthy Jameis” as an excuse could help his case.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:08 pm
by PrimeMinister
Bootz2004 wrote:I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.


Good question. Wilson is who everyone loves here so I included him. I just blanked on Jimmy G. I doubt anyone would choose him, but it could be interesting. Taylor, Cousins, Trubisky and Bortles are not good or interesting enough.

Luck might never play again so he is out. Not sure why but for some reason I have Newton and Stafford classified as “not young QBs”. They should have been included if Wilson was included.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:10 pm
by PrimeMinister
BCULAW wrote:We got to see “good Jameis” in his full glory tonight - blocking for his RB, making plays with his legs, extending plays with great pocket awareness, and throwing with accuracy and precision all over the field. Loved the composure. He has talent to spare. We just need him to be more consistent and I have to think that will come with more experience.


I can do without Winston blocking for his RB. Coolhighlight but we have seen what an injury costs us: a half season of bad Winston. Let the RB get tackled and play the next play.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:26 pm
by Doctor
PrimeMinister wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:I just realized something. How is Russell Wilson on there but not other "young" QBs like Luck, Newton, Cousins, Bottles, Garrapollo, Taylor, Stafford, Trubisky? All of those guys are either the same age or younger than Wilson.


Good question. Wilson is who everyone loves here so I included him. I just blanked on Jimmy G. I doubt anyone would choose him, but it could be interesting. Taylor, Cousins, Trubisky and Bortles are not good or interesting enough.

Luck I’m at never play again so he is out. Not sure why but for some reason I have Newton and Stafford classified as “not young QBs”. They should have been included if Wilson was included.

They came into the league before Wilson. Wilson was a little on the older side when he came out and people forget he's actually 29. Meanwhile, Cam and Stafford came in far younger (like Winston) and people forget they are still under 30. Most people think of "young QB" more by draft class than actual age. If you were already pushing the limit of "young" by going back five years to 2012 (Wilson's class) you aren't really going to go back to 2011 or 2010.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:32 pm
by DreadNaught
PrimeMinister wrote:
BCULAW wrote:We got to see “good Jameis” in his full glory tonight - blocking for his RB, making plays with his legs, extending plays with great pocket awareness, and throwing with accuracy and precision all over the field. Loved the composure. He has talent to spare. We just need him to be more consistent and I have to think that will come with more experience.


I can do without Winston blocking for his RB. Coolhighlight but we have seen what an injury costs us: a half season of bad Winston. Let the RB get tackled and play the next play.


Agreed, but that was 3rd and short iirc so it was an important play to get some tough yards. I actually like that about Jameis but would rather not see him do it. But in that situation I can live with it.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:19 pm
by PrimeMinister
DreadNaught wrote:
PrimeMinister wrote:
I can do without Winston blocking for his RB. Coolhighlight but we have seen what an injury costs us: a half season of bad Winston. Let the RB get tackled and play the next play.


Agreed, but that was 3rd and short iirc so it was an important play to get some tough yards. I actually like that about Jameis but would rather not see him do it. But in that situation I can live with it.


I love that Jameis sees himself as a football player and not just the QB, but I still would rather him not throw that block. We need a healthy Jameis Winston more than we need that first down.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:26 pm
by Bootz2004
I'd rather see Jameis throwing that block than I would Adam Humphries or Desean Jackson.

Re: Better young QB’s than Winston?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:40 am
by sanka
PM this is an overaction thread. I mean common, the guy played the Falcons. This game was not even his best game against the Falcons, we can count about 3 games including this. He always plays very well against Falcons with a 3-2 record against them.