Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

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Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Moozician » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:27 am

And which was your favorite?

For me? I hated the pick of Raheem Morris. I just didn't think he had the necessary experience to lead this team to recovery.

My favorite? Sam Wyche. Closely followed by Tony Dungy.
Last edited by Moozician on Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which Bucs HC did you hate?

Postby NYBF » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:35 am

Hating the coach and hating the hiring of the coach are different. I agree with you that Raheem didn't have the experience, but I don't hold any ill will toward him.
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Re: Which Bucs HC did you hate?

Postby Cheb » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:38 am

I loved Gruden. Firing him was one of this franchises' biggest mistakes.

I have been disappointed and upset by many Bucs coaches, sometimes disproportionately so. Still, I wouldn't say that I hate any of them. I'd shake their hand and thank them for their time with the Bucs, maybe buy them a beer and talk football if time and circumstance permitted.
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Re: Which Bucs HC did you hate?

Postby Moozician » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:56 am

NYBF wrote:Hating the coach and hating the hiring of the coach are different. I agree with you that Raheem didn't have the experience, but I don't hold any ill will toward him.


Yeah, maybe I should reword that. I don't actually hate anyone (except Ex-wives).
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:17 am

Raheem and Schiano - Glazer boys/Dom tried to be trendy and copy what other teams were doing at the time instead of getting the best NFL Head Coach. Part of that was the owners being cheap also.

Koetter is my favorite. A guy that has cut his teeth in both college and the NFL. Earned his stripes and deserved the position. Good coaching pedigree and right mix of old school football coach and new school ability to relate to players. Most of all he understands it's a players league and that he needs to adjust his scheme to the strengths of his players instead of trying to force a round peg into a square hole.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Teitan » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:19 am

Raheem and Lovie were probably the biggest mistakes. Schiano wouldn't have been my pick from the college ranks but atleast they had a goal of establishing order with him. Something just feels right with Koetter.
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Re: Which Bucs HC did you hate?

Postby real bucs fan » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:25 am

Cheb wrote:I loved Gruden. Firing him was one of this franchises' biggest mistakes.

I have been disappointed and upset by many Bucs coaches, sometimes disproportionately so. Still, I wouldn't say that I hate any of them. I'd shake their hand and thank them for their time with the Bucs, maybe buy them a beer and talk football if time and circumstance permitted.


Ya, I agree, I was quite outspoken about that at the time. Called our decent into the shithole.

The only hiring I loved was Koetter. Raheem lost me at his opening presser when he came across as a draft pick more than a coach. Shiano was a WTF. Lovie was an eyeroll but I got on board.

Really happy with the Koetter/Smith combo we have now though.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Doctor » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:31 am

Have to agree that Gruden was the best hire. There's no way around it, he brought us the trophy. He continually tried to crack open a window that had closed on the Bucs and perhaps his refusal to go into a full rebuild right away didn't help. But seriously, who is really going to pitch a full rebuild after a Superbowl win? He clashed severely with Bruce Allen, who was another really headstrong person, but Bruce was here to fix a horrible cap situation and he did an excellent job, painful, but excellent. We've been in great cap shape ever since. Gruden never got a QB to work with except for scraps. I, like a few others here, was super excited for the Josh Johnson era to begin, but it never came to be as we fired Jon too soon.

Raheem is definitely the worse of recent times. He pretty much tried to run a whole ship just him and Olson and it was a disaster. Don't really blame him though, I mean if the owners want to throw a HC job your way are you really not even going to take a swing? For all you know you never get another shot again in your life. It was a bad, sloppy hire from the start.

I actually liked the Schiano hire. I thought it was very much what we needed. But similar to Lovie I think there just wasn't enough time or patience. He was also burned by an unstable staff. That leg of continually firing coaches was terrible, and each coach had to try their best to make **** work with the players of the last coach and then by the time they started to get a roster they liked, they were canned and it would all repeat.

The DK hire is becoming one of my favorites but I see it like a co-hire of DK and Mike Smith. I love Mike Smith and was a huge defender of his during the really low points last season. I think he's a hell of a coach and together I think they make a hell of a team. If we learned anything from the other hires before them it's that you are only as good as your staff and DK and Litch have surrounded themselves with good people.

I will always love and appreciate Tony Dungy, but I think he should have been fired sooner. The guy is a great builder and a great regular season coach, but he's just not a playoff winner. And that's fine, there are a lot of coaches like that. Marvin Lewis. Andy Reid. Marty Schottenheimer. John Fox. Dungy had to be dragged kicking and screaming to a championship by one of the GOATs. He's like a guy who will just do the same thing he's always done and if he wins he wins and if not not. Just walk away saying "Hm, guess it wasn't our day today".
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Buc2 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:43 am

Good post, Doc.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Naismith » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:46 am

My least favorite hirings were Chip Kelly and Dirk Koetter.

With Dirk, it was more about how it went down. I didn't like firing Lovie just to hire Dirk and either adding an opening for offensive coordinator or having a first time NFL HC have to wear two hats. I also wanted them to do a legit coaching search before just naming him coach.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Bootz2004 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:51 am

Lovie. Too much of an attempt to relive the Dungy era.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Swashy » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:00 am

I absolutely despised the hiring of Greg Schiano at the time it happened. I still remember the exact moment. I was in college walking across the bridge. My buddy texted me the news with a picture and I literally stopped in my tracks and paused for at least 10 seconds in disbelief. And I said out loud, "Who the **** is THIS guy?" I read up and I felt like a getting a shot at the doctor's office. Then I come to find out he wasn't even our first choice. But I cooled off when we brought in all those free agents, when we instituted an actual NFL offense and went 7-9. But by the time we blew that game to Seattle in 2013 I was ready for his head on a silver platter. But in hindsight it's better we didn't sign Chip Kelly. For history's sake it just happened to be a blessing in disguise -just an unfortunate one.

I wasn't a big fan of firing Lovie Smith (because God knows we had been through enough coaches) but I had nothing against Dirk Koetter as coach.

Ironically I was in full favor of the hiring of Lovie Smith at the time and I liked the Gruden hiring at the time. But by the time Gruden was fired I pretty much said, "Thank God." I was absolutely sick of his QB carousel and I was even more sick of his sorry ass dink and dunk offense that required no less than half a dozen 1st down conversions per TD drive because his offense that required a PHD to run and decipher didn't have a passing play longer than 8 yards per pass.

With the exception of that time Jeff Garcia hit Galloway up the middle and he took it for a house call and Chris Simms hitting Edell Shepherd against the Skins I struggle to find any memorable passes beyond 15 yards outside of the 2002 season.
Last edited by Swashy on Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:06 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Moozician » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:01 am

Naismith wrote:My least favorite hirings were Chip Kelly and Dirk Koetter.

With Dirk, it was more about how it went down. I didn't like firing Lovie just to hire Dirk and either adding an opening for offensive coordinator or having a first time NFL HC have to wear two hats. I also wanted them to do a legit coaching search before just naming him coach.

Huh? Chip Kelly? When did that happen?

I agree that the circumstances surrounding the fiasco of firing Lovie Smith in order to promote DK were somewhat dis-favorable. Remember Dungy being shown the back-door when we got Gruden?
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Buc2 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:11 am

Favorite hires to me were McKay & Gruden. I loved McKay...funny man and built a damn fine team from nothing. Literally. From. Nothing. Loved Gruden...Super Bowl!


Worst hires to me were Raheem and Leeman. I wasn't even happy with Raheem being named the DC, let alone when they turned right around and made him HC a couple days later. Leeman Bennett. What's to say. Back to back 2-14 seasons. :cussingblack:
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Naismith » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:19 am

Moozician wrote:
Naismith wrote:My least favorite hirings were Chip Kelly and Dirk Koetter.

With Dirk, it was more about how it went down. I didn't like firing Lovie just to hire Dirk and either adding an opening for offensive coordinator or having a first time NFL HC have to wear two hats. I also wanted them to do a legit coaching search before just naming him coach.

Huh? Chip Kelly? When did that happen?

I agree that the circumstances surrounding the fiasco of firing Lovie Smith in order to promote DK were somewhat dis-favorable. Remember Dungy being shown the back-door when we got Gruden?


Chip Kelly accepted the job and then overnight, backed out. I was sad when they hired him and happy he backed out.

I hated the way they handled Dungy and I couldn't stand Gruden as a coach, but that wasn't until later on. At the time of his hire, I was optimistic. I can't imagine how angry I'd be about trading those picks for a head coach today, though!
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Swashy » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:27 am

Buc2 wrote:Favorite hires to me were McKay & Gruden. I loved McKay...funny man and built a damn fine team from nothing. Literally. From. Nothing. Loved Gruden...Super Bowl!


Worst hires to me were Raheem and Leeman. I wasn't even happy with Raheem being named the DC, let alone when they turned right around and made him HC a couple days later. Leeman Bennett. What's to say. Back to back 2-14 seasons. :cussingblack:


It was before I was even born but didn't the hiring of Leeman Bennett also piss off the entire locker room because they wanted Wayne Fontes instead? I think I remember reading that somewhere.


Late edit: agreed about McKay. He was an outstanding selection. It's just a damn shame it took 26 games for them to finally win that 1st game. The expansion Bucs were terrible make no mistake but that 1976 team had at least 1 or 2 wins in them and just sadly never got it. Based on all my research I'd warrant that the 1977 team was actually worse simply because of how inept that offense was. When Ricky Bell can't even crack 500 yards in 11 games and you score 3 passing TD's all season long there's a really serious problem. Like you said.... from nothing.

And for what it's worth that defense was astonishingly good from the very get go. Weren't they ranked something like 12th in the NFL by 1977 and something like 7th by 1978? The only word to describe that kind of progress is "outstanding".... kind like the selection of McKay
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby theBKwhopper » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:41 am

I didn't really hate any hirings. I wasn't a fan of Raheem. I agree that Lovie was too much of an attempt to relive glory days, but I like Lovie as a coach. I liked Schiano because I was tired of seeing our lazy-ass team. I like Koetter, as well.

Also, I didn't care for firing Gruden, either. But, you gotta admit that our drafting was terrible during his regime.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Buc2 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:01 pm

Swashy wrote:
Buc2 wrote:Favorite hires to me were McKay & Gruden. I loved McKay...funny man and built a damn fine team from nothing. Literally. From. Nothing. Loved Gruden...Super Bowl!


Worst hires to me were Raheem and Leeman. I wasn't even happy with Raheem being named the DC, let alone when they turned right around and made him HC a couple days later. Leeman Bennett. What's to say. Back to back 2-14 seasons. :cussingblack:


It was before I was even born but didn't the hiring of Leeman Bennett also piss off the entire locker room because they wanted Wayne Fontes instead? I think I remember reading that somewhere.


Late edit: agreed about McKay. He was an outstanding selection. It's just a damn shame it took 26 games for them to finally win that 1st game. The expansion Bucs were terrible make no mistake but that 1976 team had at least 1 or 2 wins in them and just sadly never got it. Based on all my research I'd warrant that the 1977 team was actually worse simply because of how inept that offense was. When Ricky Bell can't even crack 500 yards in 11 games and you score 3 passing TD's all season long there's a really serious problem. Like you said.... from nothing.

And for what it's worth that defense was astonishingly good from the very get go. Weren't they ranked something like 12th in the NFL by 1977 and something like 7th by 1978? The only word to describe that kind of progress is "outstanding".... kind like the selection of McKay


The only good Bennett ever did was trade for Steve DeBerg (not a great player, but better than any QB we'd had to that point other than Doug Williams). The very next year, he selected Bo Jackson with the #1 overall pick even though Bo flat out said he would sit out the year before he'd ever suit up for Culverhouse's team. Yeah. **** Leeman Bennett!

As for McKay's teams those first three years, I was fortunate to have been in the navy at the time so I rarely got to see them play, and I don't remember a lot of the details from those seasons. I got out in August '79 and was able to attend a bunch of games that year, including both playoff games. It was simply amazing he had that team one win away from the SB in only its 4th year of existence. Abe Gibron's defenses were awesome.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby MarineBuc » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:05 pm

I hated the hiring of Morris and Lovie for stated reasons...Morris was trying the replicate the perceived Tomlin deal and then Smith was trying replicate the Dungy days. I guess the hiring I despised was Lovie...Bears fans laughed at us when we hired him. I wanted to get on board with Lovie, but he never did anything to make that happen.

I was over the moon for Gruden and optimistic about Schiano.

Gruden needed a strong GM to fill his roster and Allen was definately not the guy. Gruden was just not a talent evaluator.

Schiano was just too rigid from the start...I think he learned from his stint and will be a better coach for it.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby NJDungeoneer » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:13 pm

Leeman Bennett is by far the worst hire in Bucs history, he was a car salesman in Atlanta after being fired by them!

Ray Perkins is number two, he drafted a QB in the first round(Testaverde), after leaving Alabama that had a HOF LB on their roster that the Bucs Passed On(under his direction)

Morris is number 3, but he was just in over his head at the time.

Best, has to be Dungy, he turned a sorry franchise into a contender, and he did it the right way.

Second best is Gruden, for the obvious reasons.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby DreadNaught » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:23 pm

Leeman was the worst.

Richard Williamson was bad also.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Buc You » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:49 pm

I don't think I ever despised a hire but, I didn't like the Schiano move(The best we could do was a C-USA coach, are you shitting me?) until the Eric LeGrande "signing."
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby KiffininCanton » Fri Apr 14, 2017 3:58 pm

Gruden hire was the best. It was a bold aggressive move that many owners would shy away from but Glazer knew our chance for a Super Bowl was NOW. But, I still to this day absolutely support his firing, when 7 seasons into your tenure, the 3 best pieces of the franchise were pieces you inherited (Kiffin, Brooks and Barber) and the hope you're selling is Josh Johnson to lead the franchise, well, I think that says it all.

Worst hire hands down Raheem. Completely unqualified, if you spent 5 minutes with the guy it was clear he did not have the personality to be a NFL HC and the worst part was the Glazers just handed him the job without even having a open interview process. I always say I support giving a coach 2-3 seasons unless it's clear he is a disaster after the 1st season. Raheem was one of those disasters. The hiring of a 3-4 DC, the London shopping spree, Rich Gannon during the broadcast of the Jets game saying our Friday walk through was the worst he had ever seen, clear Raheem didn't have the NFL HC chops from day 1.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Sammich » Fri Apr 14, 2017 4:04 pm

Despise might be too strong a word, but my least favorite was Raheem Morris. I thought (and still think) that he was a very good coach but he just wasn't ready to be an NFL head coach. He was green in both age and experience. The jump from DB coach to head coach was just too big. Had we bumped him to DC and brought in an experienced HC for him to learn from I think Raheem's career would have turned out much better.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Doctor » Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:35 pm

MarineBuc wrote:I hated the hiring of Morris and Lovie for stated reasons...Morris was trying the replicate the perceived Tomlin deal and then Smith was trying replicate the Dungy days. I guess the hiring I despised was Lovie...Bears fans laughed at us when we hired him. I wanted to get on board with Lovie, but he never did anything to make that happen.

I was over the moon for Gruden and optimistic about Schiano.

Gruden needed a strong GM to fill his roster and Allen was definately not the guy. Gruden was just not a talent evaluator.

Schiano was just too rigid from the start...I think he learned from his stint and will be a better coach for it.

And that's really what it was, both signings seemed like they were trying to replicate something else instead of being their own signings.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby nhbucsfan » Fri Apr 14, 2017 6:56 pm

HATED Sciano hire, after Chip changed his mind, it seems like we just said "That's ok, we'll hire our own college coach.

HATED HATED HATED HATED the Lovie hire. The second Schiano was rumored to be gone, everyone knew Lovie was on board.

I may be in the monority, but I was/am not thrilled with Koetter hire. It seems like we were trying too hard to keep the continuity for Winston. We'll waste a few great years of Jameis going 8-8 or 9-7 before we move on.

This all ties to the general incompetence of the Glazer boys.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Teitan » Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:25 pm

Interesting.. we have our first winning season in years and you think Koetter is a waste? Continuity for Jameis IS important. Another very competent move by the Glazers is keeping continuity on the defensive side with Smith.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby MJW » Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:46 pm

It's my nature to buy in when they get hired. I don't believe in being negative when someone hasn't gotten a chance yet. I save the negativity for ten minutes into the season.

Sometimes I'm confused by a hire, but that doesn't stop me from getting behind the guy to start.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Bootz2004 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:26 pm

MJW wrote:It's my nature to buy in when they get hired. I don't believe in being negative when someone hasn't gotten a chance yet. I save the negativity for ten minutes into the season.

Sometimes I'm confused by a hire, but that doesn't stop me from getting behind the guy to start.


The American way: Whatever the government tells you is the truth.
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Re: Which Bucs HC hiring did you despise?

Postby Caradoc » Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:58 pm

Hated the Raheem hire. It was blatantly obvious he had no business being a head coach.

Opposed the Lovie hire. Actively hated him as a coach one it became clear he was completely incompetent - aka when he anointed McCown. (It only became clear that was to tank later.)

I was agnostic on the Schiano hire. I hoped it would go well, and it had potential, but then Freeman became a giant scumbag, and the media played him off as a victim of a monster because they were pissy they didn't get the same access from Schiano that they used to get. By the time it became clear Josh was the bad guy in all that it was too late, too many people were convinced Schiano was Hitler and Typhoid Mary's secret love child. I don't think he would have turned out to be a great coach, but we'll never know.
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