***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!***

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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Mex-Buc » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:17 pm

Joe "Mr. I get injured every 10 snaps" Hawley agreed to a two year extension with the Bucs..

http://www.buccaneers.com/news/article- ... 0c0308bf2e
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Teitan » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:20 pm

Looks like no Zuttah then
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby IchabodCrane84 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:24 pm

Mex-Buc wrote:Joe "Mr. I get injured every 10 snaps" Hawley agreed to a two year extension with the Bucs..

http://www.buccaneers.com/news/article- ... 0c0308bf2e


That's Hawley. Just when you think he's done, he comes trotting back onto the field.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby DreadNaught » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:25 pm

Great!! Evan Smith and Jow Hawley back at Center...

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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:27 pm

Should put all of this "Ali Marpet is moving to Center" talk to bed for good now.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Buc2 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:28 pm

IchabodCrane84 wrote:
Mex-Buc wrote:Joe "Mr. I get injured every 10 snaps" Hawley agreed to a two year extension with the Bucs..

http://www.buccaneers.com/news/article- ... 0c0308bf2e


That's Hawley. Just when you think he's done, he comes trotting back onto the field.

Yep. Plus he must be smarter than Marpet.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Miller4Prez64 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:38 pm

Glad to have Hawley back.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:53 pm

Joe Hawley is a ****ing warrior!
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Buc You » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:00 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Joe Hawley is a ****ing warrior!

A mediocre warrior, but a warrior none the less.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby beardmcdoug » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:01 pm

Buc You wrote:
Mountaineer Buc wrote:Joe Hawley is a ****ing warrior!

A mediocre warrior, but a warrior none the less.


lol
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby DreadNaught » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:08 pm

Joe Hawley sucks at football. He's a below average NFL Center. I like he toughness and intangibles like everyone else. But he still gets pushed around way to much and can't block any NFL DT on his own.

Center and Safety were the two of the weakest areas needing requiring an upgrade and we let McDougald walk for Wilcox and bringing back below average players like Evan Smith and Joe Hawley.

I love the signings of DJax and Baker.

I'll judge the offseason when it's over, but this move doesn't make the team better imo.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby real bucs fan » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:11 pm

I think there's still a shot we draft someone, but agree, rather disappointing
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Mex-Buc » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:15 pm

IchabodCrane84 wrote:
Mex-Buc wrote:Joe "Mr. I get injured every 10 snaps" Hawley agreed to a two year extension with the Bucs..

http://www.buccaneers.com/news/article- ... 0c0308bf2e


That's Hawley. Just when you think he's done, he comes trotting back onto the field.


Can't forget all of his late "blocks" which have resulted in some penalties..

Don't get me wrong, I like the toughness he brings to this unit, but he's mediocre at blocking.. I hope they bring more competition for this spot, or at least have a rookie grooming behind him.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby MJW » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:28 pm

Joe Hawley sucks. He's the Chris Hovan of his generation - a "warrior" and "tough guy" who gets tossed around like a My Buddy at a sleepover for ADD children but for some reason has a job for life here.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby AMERICAN MUSCLE » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:28 pm

Joe Hawley is a better version of Ted Larsen. You want guys like that on your team.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby IchabodCrane84 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:46 pm

Mex-Buc wrote:
IchabodCrane84 wrote:
That's Hawley. Just when you think he's done, he comes trotting back onto the field.


Can't forget all of his late "blocks" which have resulted in some penalties..

Don't get me wrong, I like the toughness he brings to this unit, but he's mediocre at blocking.. I hope they bring more competition for this spot, or at least have a rookie grooming behind him.


I fully believe we'll draft his eventual replacement, but not being worse at the position than last year is comforting. Plus one could say he'll play better if he got 100% healthy this off-season.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby real bucs fan » Wed Mar 15, 2017 5:07 pm

Well at least we know if someone takes a cheapshot at Jameis, Hawley is around to go after them.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby 2.0 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:28 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:Should put all of this "Ali Marpet is moving to Center" talk to bed for good now.


Nahh the dude could retire as a Hall of Fame Guard and people will be wondering if he should have played Center
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Super K » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:31 pm

MJW wrote:Joe Hawley sucks. He's the Chris Hovan of his generation - a "warrior" and "tough guy" who gets tossed around like a My Buddy at a sleepover for ADD children but for some reason has a job for life here.


LMAO...well said
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby rephyr » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:48 pm

Why would Marpet, who is shaping up to be a pro bowl caliber guard, agree to move to center where he'll make considerably less money over the course of his career? If he's so smart, I'm sure he knows how to look at the numbers.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Caradoc » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:54 pm

Our OL wasn't as near bad as fans make it out to be. THat said it did take a couple of steps backwards.

This came from a couple of reasons:

First, Dotson regressed. He used to be a better than average pass blocker and below average run blocker. This year he was an average pass blocker (at best) and way below average run blocker.

But the big thing was the loss of Mangold. No only was he replaced by a much inferior player, but having Pamphile there exposed Hawley. He just doesn't have the strength to hold his ground. Yeah, he's got a great attitude, but he's injury prone, sooner or later (very likely sooner) he will be out for a long period. He needs to be replaced. Pamphile might improve, but Hawley will still be a weakness.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Teitan » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:57 pm

Caradoc wrote:Our OL wasn't as near bad as fans make it out to be. THat said it did take a couple of steps backwards.

This came from a couple of reasons:

First, Dotson regressed. He used to be a better than average pass blocker and below average run blocker. This year he was an average pass blocker (at best) and way below average run blocker.

But the big thing was the loss of Mangold. No only was he replaced by a much inferior player, but having Pamphile there exposed Hawley. He just doesn't have the strength to hold his ground. Yeah, he's got a great attitude, but he's injury prone, sooner or later (very likely sooner) he will be out for a long period. He needs to be replaced. Pamphile might improve, but Hawley will still be a weakness.



We never had mangold
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Naismith » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:12 pm

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ra ... is-season/

23. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (27)
Top overall grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.5 (No. 14)

Top pass-blocking grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.1 (No. 23)

Top run-blocking grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.4 (No. 5)

The left side of the Buccaneers’ line was a real problem area, with the play of LT Donovan Smith proving to be a real issue. Smith surrendered 57 total QB pressures and 14 penalties over his season, with Kevin Pamphile inside of him chipping in with 32 pressures of his own. Second-year player Ali Marpet continued his development with solid play, especially in the run game, while Joe Hawley and Demar Dotson were capable starters at center and right tackle, respectively. The line wasn’t helped when injury forced them to bring Gosder Cherilus into the lineup at right tackle, as he was beaten for three sacks and two hurries in just two games starting before being sent back to the bench to end the year.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

21st ranked run blocking, 15th in pass blocking.

32nd in power success (Power Success: Percentage of runs on third or fourth down, two yards or less to go, that achieved a first down or touchdown. Also includes runs on first-and-goal or second-and-goal from the two-yard line or closer. This is the only statistic on this page that includes quarterbacks.).

Also relevant, Bucs had the sixth most rushing attempts, so they are not succeeding at dictating a rushing offense to opponents.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:20 pm

Naismith wrote:https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season/

23. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (27)
Top overall grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.5 (No. 14)

Top pass-blocking grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.1 (No. 23)

Top run-blocking grade: RG Ali Marpet, 84.4 (No. 5)

The left side of the Buccaneers’ line was a real problem area, with the play of LT Donovan Smith proving to be a real issue. Smith surrendered 57 total QB pressures and 14 penalties over his season, with Kevin Pamphile inside of him chipping in with 32 pressures of his own. Second-year player Ali Marpet continued his development with solid play, especially in the run game, while Joe Hawley and Demar Dotson were capable starters at center and right tackle, respectively. The line wasn’t helped when injury forced them to bring Gosder Cherilus into the lineup at right tackle, as he was beaten for three sacks and two hurries in just two games starting before being sent back to the bench to end the year.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

21st ranked run blocking, 15th in pass blocking.

32nd in power success (Power Success: Percentage of runs on third or fourth down, two yards or less to go, that achieved a first down or touchdown. Also includes runs on first-and-goal or second-and-goal from the two-yard line or closer. This is the only statistic on this page that includes quarterbacks.).

Also relevant, Bucs had the sixth most rushing attempts, so they are not succeeding at dictating a rushing offense to opponents.


Dirk Koetter would tell you to take these rankings and shove them up your ass. If there is any position that PFF reports are completely worthless it's Oline.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Naismith » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:25 pm

Next time you talk to him, ask him how he feels about Football Outsiders.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby DreadNaught » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:32 pm

IchabodCrane84 wrote:
Mex-Buc wrote:
Can't forget all of his late "blocks" which have resulted in some penalties..

Don't get me wrong, I like the toughness he brings to this unit, but he's mediocre at blocking.. I hope they bring more competition for this spot, or at least have a rookie grooming behind him.


I fully believe we'll draft his eventual replacement, but not being worse at the position than last year is comforting. Plus one could say he'll play better if he got 100% healthy this off-season.


It's tough to get worse than having a scrap heap FA like Joe Hawley as the starting Center.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:44 pm

Somebody have the PFF numbers on Hawley so I can quantify what a shitty player he is?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:08 pm

Naismith wrote:Next time you talk to him, ask him how he feels about Football Outsiders.



“You know, I’ve always – since I came here over a year ago – I’ve always said, ‘Our O-line gets beat up way more than they deserve,’ Koetter said. “There’s plenty of teams that have O-line issues and we feel like we have pretty decent depth on our O-line all the way down – knock on wood – all the way down into our practice squad. We feel good about the guys we’ve got and they’re playing well together. I give credit to [run game coordinator/offensive line] George [Warhop], [assistant offensive line] Butch [Barry] who work with them every day, but I give credit to those guys. We’ve got good leadership in the room, those guys are playing hard.

“I know there’s the critics out there that have their own grading scale, the mysterious grading scale. We look at our own grading scale. We’re going to grade them how – because we know what they are supposed to be doing every play. Other people that grade them, how do you grade someone when you don’t know what they are supposed to do?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Naismith » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:09 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Somebody have the PFF numbers on Hawley so I can quantify what a shitty player he is?


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Re: ***OFFICIAL 2017 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Off-Season Thread!

Postby Bootz2004 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:14 pm

Interestingly those PFF figures show that Hawley did better in 2016 than 2015 but the masses here think it was the other way around......and according to the numbers it's not even close
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