Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

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Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Cheb » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:55 pm

Last week against the Seahawks was potentially Devin White's breakout NFL game thus far in his young career. His box score was impressive; 12 total tackles, 5 solo, a half sack, a half TFL, and two QB hits. His performance on paper was right up there with the middle linebacker we were playing, perennial All-Pro Bobby Wagner.

Fan opinions on this game, however, were split. Some said that he was consistently a step late and looked lost frequently. Others said that he was finally coming into his own.

The best way to solve this is by doing a film breakdown. Today, we'll be doing that for every snap that Devin White took in this Week Nine matchup. I'll be looking at the coaches' film from NFL Gamepass (formerly NFL Rewind), both sideline and box angles. I watch every play at least a dozen times, if not more. I'll try to put in some fancy MS Paint graphics as well if I find something particularly interesting or illuminating.

Without further ado, let's get into it.

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First defensive drive, already up 7-0, good job offense. Snap one. Seattle in the shotgun, 12 personnel, we're in base defense. Seattle motions a tight end, White calls out adjustments to his teammates in response to the motion, good to see. Seattle passes to a wideout on a curl route; VH3's technique was total crap here, spun around and flipped his hips every which way. He and Scotty Miller must take ballet classes together; they never move in a straight line when moving in a huge circle would work worse. But whatever, lets focus on White here. The defense is in Cover-1, which we run alot. White is responsible for the runningback, who stays in to block. White sits in a spy and reads the quarterback. What I don't like is Russell Wilson is staring down VH3's man the entire time. White would have been well within his rights to adjust his drop, and keep following Wilson's eyes out laterally. Would it have made a difference on this play, maybe or maybe not, the ball was out pretty fast in any case. Maybe White is being told to keep his hook zones shallower and more centralized to contain Wilson? We'll find out as the game progresses. Anyways, the ball gets out, White shows good pursuit and angles, and helps VH3 bring down the receiver.

Next play, Seattle runs a playaction fake to the left, Wilson rolls out to the right and dumps it off to Lockett for an easy ten yard gain. VH3 was in man coverage, and got masterfully rubbed by Seattle wideout Malik Turner. Lockett caught the ball with no Buc within seven yards. Not a good look by our defense. What's even worse is that Seattle had a dead-easy touchdown here if Wilson looked towards the middle of the field. We were in Cover-1 man defense again, and SMB let his man run totally free on a crossing route. Malik Turner, SMB's responsibility, would have walked in for a 65-yard touchdown. Anyways, back to White again. His responsibility was the runner; he read outside zone blocking, flowed downhill, and picked up the runner in man coverage, which he did a good job at.

Shotgun, nickel personnel. First run of the day. Inside zone to the strong side. White fills his strongsdie A gap like he should. The defensive line is GOOD here. Vea and Suh again take on three blockers like they are children, Nassib and JPP don't move an inch, and Shaq takes the tight end for a ride. White and LVD are basically untouched. It's fun to play linebacker when you can run and chase, without having to worry about pesky offensive linemen. I just wanna highlight Vea here. He gets combo'd by the center and guard here; Vea PANCAKES the center and throws off the guard. People cry foul saying that Vea was potentially a wasted pick, but Jesus Christ he's good. Anyways, back to White. LVD makes first contact on the runner, and White helps with cleanup. White did his job here, but the defensive line did amazing.

2nd and 8. Shotgun with four wideouts, trips to the left, we're in nickel. Seattle motions their back to the left, making it quads. In many defenses, there are automatic adjustments made when the offense is in trips or quads (that's three or four receivers to one side of the formation), if they motion to increase the number of receivers to one side. If you don't make those adjustments, your defense can easily break. It appears that some of our defenders made this adjustment, while others did not. I literally have no idea what kind of defense this is supposed to be. It's all kinds of Frankensteined, and I imagine the film session was... colorful to say the least. Anyways, White does his job, plays his hook, then moves up to pressure Wilson into the throw. Not an official QB pressure, but he did his job well. Seriously guys, what the **** was that? Many questions here. I tried to do a photo to demonstrate, but it just made my head hurt. In the end, Seattle completes an easy corner route to Lockett against this wtf coverage.

I'll try to focus more on White, sorry. 1st down. Seattle runs a playaction fake, then a screen to Carson. White reads the guards correctly and is not fooled by the PA fake. He drops well to his hook, then pursues like a pro to the ball and hits Carson out of bounds. He did his job well and got a solo tackle here. As an aside, Vea decleats their center again, then motors his fabulous hair 20 yards downfield to the ball. He's down there with the cornerbacks. I ****ing love Vita Vea. Good playcall by the Seahawks, well executed by them.

1st and ten from our 20 yardline. Shotgun, Trips right, Cover-1 defense in nickel. Dean, our untested rookie, gets rubbed by Jaron Brown, giving Lockett a three-yard head start. To Dean's credit, he closes really well and is a heartbeat away from knocking the ball away. Good play design by Seattle, Lockett catches the TD, tie game. The broadcast did a good job identifying the rub route, so I won't rehash that here with pictures. Our man Devin White is the hole defender in the middle of the field, keying on Wilson. Wilson throws the ball way over his head, nothing White coulda done here, he did his job. We can't play rub routes for ****, by the way. Burned twice on them already, both times by Lockett. It's almost like Seattle gameplanned it that way. Hmmmm!!! Let's see how the game progresses.

---

Second drive, tied 7 to 7. Shotgun, nickel, blah blah. Cover-1 defense again; we are mostly in Cover-1, for those playing along at home. Pass play on the outside, Metcalf versus Dean on a backshoulder throw, Dean knocks it down easily. White is in man, responsible for the running back, who stays in to block. White sees the runner move out to block JPP, and thinks about blitzing, but the ball is out too fast. A note on the rush here; Suh and JPP both try to rush through C-gap, and are thus easily taken care of by the tackle and Carson. Poor rush plan there. Had Suh bull rushed through the B (as he probably was called to do), this would have been a much better rush rep. Anyways, good job all around outside of that, good PBU by Dean.

2nd-and-10. Pistol formation and 12 personnel, base personnel on defense, again we're in Cover-1 defense. Seattle tries the same playaction zone run fake to the left, bootleg right to a crosser that they tried on the first drive. Since this isn't going to Lockett, we do a far better job of locking it down. Whitehead does a great job staying in phase with the tight end and contests at the catch point, nearly got a pick here. White's job is first and foremost to honor the PA fake, and the offensive line does a good job of selling it. Had this been an actual run, White would have been in position for a TFL. When the runner peels off into a wheel route after the fake, White is step-for-step with him. He did his job well.

3rd-and-10. Shotgun, 11 personnel, trips right, versus our nickel personnel and (you guessed it) a Cover-1 man defense. We are as predictable as the sunrise. Seattle tries to do a rub route (AGAIN!), but Whitehead isn't fooled or rubbed. Minimal gain to the right on an out-route to the tight end, we force a fourth down. I don't really know what White's assignment was here. LVD was on the back, the free safety was deep (as always in Cover-1 man), so White was given free reign it seems. It looks like he wanted to blitz through the weakside A-gap while Vea stunted to the weakside B, but the center was ready for him. White and the center stared each other down without making contact. Had he hard-rushed that weakside A, this could have been a solid pressure, as Anthony Nelson was stunting to the strongside A gap, and the center would have been unable to help. As is, White just kinda bounced on his toes at the line of scrimmage and tried to look useful. He wasn't. I would love to know what he was told to do here. Was he told to spy Wilson while hiding in the trash, waiting for him to break the pocket then chase him down? Was he told to blitz the A gap, but decided not to when he saw that he was going to get blocked? Or was he told to freelance and just make plays? If it was the first option, fine. If it was the second, I'd say he should have just stuck his nose in there and given it a go. If the third, I'd say he needs to be more decisive, as sitting at the line of scrimmage and hoping the offensive line forgets about you so that if the play is extended you may have a free shot at Wilson is a poor overall strategm. But I digress. It's plays like this that make people wonder if he's thinking too much or if the game seems to quick for him, because standing there without making discernable football moves is very puzzling. Anyways, good overall team defense, good job Whitehead, wtf play from White.

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3rd drive. 1st and ten. Shotgun, 12 personnel, versus base defense. It's been a wall of text so far, and this is a good one for visual aids. Let's get some pictures in, shall we?

Image

Here we are presnap. Our single gap responsibilities are in red. I explain it in the photo, but the Seahawks are running a power run with two pulling linemen, right at Devin White. Nothing here in exotic. Defending this is linebacking 101. Let's see what happens.

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The ball is snapped, we still don't have the handoff. The D-line is engaging, the o-line is moving. Nunez-Roches (the black circle), is flying through the playside B gap, and he is blowing up this play because of it. He's going to create a pile, tying up the two pullers from getting to their assignments, JPP and White on the left side of the picture. Notice LVD is already moving to the left, reading the flow of the guards. He knows that power is coming, and is already moving towards where the ball is going to go. Our man, Mr White, #45, is in perfect position to fly up and make a play on the ball. ****, he's unblocked, and Nunez-Roches is making his job very easy. All he needs to do is walk up and make a tackle in the hole.

Time to fast forward another half second or so.

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And here we are. Nunez-Roches (black circle) has gotten the penetration he wants (OOCA). This redirects the guard and tackle (yellow and green), slowing them down tremendously. Notice how they are tripping and stumbling.

JPP is maintaining his outside leverage, not letting the runner bounce it outside. LVD is maintaining his inside leverage, so he can disengage if the runner goes in the big hole between him and Vea.

What's White doing? Wait... why is he next to and behind LVD? Did he just walk himself into a block? Yes he did. Did he just abandon his gap? Yes he did. What the **** is he doing? You decide, but it's nothing good. I can guarantee you he isn't supposed to be doing this. He isn't reading the blockers in front of him, he's not reading the flow of the back. He drifted inside for reasons unbenownst to modern man.

I can guarantee that if Nunez-Roches hadn't derailed those pullers in the backfield, this would have been an enormous gain. This was about as vanilla a read as you could ask for, and White fucked it up.

Fast forward time!

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I just include this one to show White getting knocked down by LVD's ass. lol.

JPP is getting half-heartedly cut blocked by the pulling guard. The pulling tackle fell down without doing anything. Vea is already working himself free, Shaq is pursuing nicely, and Gholston is playing strong. Good team defense otherwise

Fast forward again!

Image

And here we are. White, to his credit, caught himself from getting splayed on his face. He recovered great and made a solid hit on Carson about a yard past the line of scrimmage. The rest of the team joins him for a group effort, ultimately stopping the runner for a five yard gain.

People look at this at first glance and say, wow, White met Carson in the hole and had a solid hit, even though he got dragged four yards. That was a good play!

But it wasn't. Had he trusted his keys and his eyes, this was a TFL at the least. Between pictures 2 and 3, he should have filled into his assigned responsibility, attacked the gap and blockers, and this would have been far better than it ultimately was.

Again, this isn't asking for Ray Lewis or Luke Kuechly level diagnostics here. This is basic linebacking. And White consistently fails at it. While his athleticism and balance allowed him to recover to get the first hit on the runner instead of just falling down when he crashed into LVD's butt (lol), he should never have been in that position in the first place.

This is the sort of thing I'm talking about when I say that he isn't a good linebacker. He's a hell of an athlete, but jesus ****ing christ. My high schoolers know this ****, and they have spent far less years in the game, and have spent far less time getting instructed on how to play the position.

---

Next play. Moar visuals!

Image

Here we see a very basic run concept. Seattle's blocking assignments in blue, our run responsibilities in red arrows as per usual, the ballcarrier's aiming point and path in orange.

The two DTs (Vea and Nunez-Roches) get combo blocked, which is initially a double team for a second or two, then one lineman peels off to block the backer. Carson is aiming for the playside A or B gap, reading the combo block on Vea and how LVD plays off of it, just looking for open grass. The arrow makes it look like he's just aiming for the A-gap, but he actually moves more towards the B. Whatever.

Fast forward a second or two.

Image

Here we see Nunez-Roches and Vea are holding up well, despite eight combined hands on them; the middle is solidly clogged.

Shaq on the left is coming off the edge unblocked after checking that Wilson didn't have the ball. JPP is maintaining outside leverage on the playside so Carson can't bounce it outside. LVD is moving forward to meet the playside guard peeling off the combo block on Vea we talked about earlier, and the backside tackle is moving towards White. Everyone seems to be doing their jobs.

What does White do here? Does he move to fill his assigned gap, further clogging the middle and attacking that lineman moving towards him? Does he scrape over the top towards the playside, flowing with the back?

What if I told you that he did neither?

FAST FORWARD!!

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What if I told you that White just bounced in place and didn't do anything? That's right. Here he is, in the pink circle of shame. He didn't engage with an offensive player until 3.5 seconds into the play. He not only waited for the offensive lineman to get up to him, he moved himself out of position and away from the ball, walling himself off from the play. He's now the box player who is furthest away from the ball, despite being unblocked this entire time and being completely unobstructed.

Thankfully, Vea, JPP, and LVD took care of the runner on the playside, but not until he grabbed a nice four yard gain. Thankfully, Carson chose to take the orange line into our actually good defenders instead of going with the green line, where he would have been 1-on-1 with our safety with a touchdown riding on the outcome of that tackle.

White didn't cover his gap. He didn't flow over the top. He didn't stick his nose in there and create more of a pile. Just just kinda stood there.

Motherfuck.

Look at the picture again. See how White is having to push off with his left leg? That's because he was working to the left, like he wanted to chase Russell Wilson, who wasn't his responsibility.

He didn't do his job. He didn't even do anyone else's job for them. He just kinda stood there.

We basically played 10 men on defense on this snap, and we're lucky that it wasn't alot worse than it was.

Exhibit two on White failing fundamental linebacking.

---

That's the first quarter. I'm going to take a breather and actually do some work at work today. I'll try to finish this game up later this afternoon and tonight.

Thoughts? Comments? Gnashing of teeth?
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Rocker » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:15 pm

Gnashing teeth through one, but it gets better.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Snake » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:22 pm

Pretty amazing content. Cheers.

Seems like White’s primary issues are mentally sifting through the trench war and knowing where to be in that mess. and tackling. Was he thinking Russell had the ball on that last one? Interesting.


Really looking forward to more.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:25 pm

Devin White SUCKS!!

Trade him for Oline!!
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:32 pm

People cry foul saying that Vea was potentially a wasted pick, but Jesus Christ he's good.


As an aside, Vea decleats their center again, then motors his fabulous hair 20 yards downfield to the ball. He's down there with the cornerbacks. I ****ing love Vita Vea.


8-)
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Snake » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:39 pm

Devin White with the ol' 49.2/100 grade from PFF so far.

Again, it's early. Just another data point.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Natural Selection » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:40 pm

This is why I keep checking the forum. Awesome read. Excellent analysis. I greatly appreciate the effort put in to this post. Thank you!

I’m honestly more pleased with what I’ve seen from 45 than I expected. He does seem to me to have cleaned up a lot of his pursuit angles. I see way fewer false steps than his college tapes. Looks like he’s gaining some better understanding. Assuming film study and repetitive practice on keys. I expected his lack of experience and instincts to lead to break down after breakdown for multiple seasons as he learned to play the position. My general feeling is he must be putting in effort and receptive to coaching. I do feel like I’m seeing consistent motor/effort. Playing through the whistle. Not getting down on mistakes and obviously letting them compound. I really appreciate reading a play by play breakdown by someone who understands what they are seeing. It sounds like he’s showing some understanding for coverage concepts and responsibilities that are also encouraging. Definitely interested in what he was seeing/thinking on a couple of those snaps. Again though, I was really down on this pick and what I perceive as his high motor is helping me turn that around. I hung my hat on what I heard of his work ethic/desire. At least that seems to be accurate. If the kid stays healthy and keeps working hard, I’m now much more confident he will become a high level ilb.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:43 pm

Natural Selection wrote:This is why I keep checking the forum. Awesome read. Excellent analysis. I greatly appreciate the effort put in to this post. Thank you!

I’m honestly more pleased with what I’ve seen from 45 than I expected. He does seem to me to have cleaned up a lot of his pursuit angles.

I see way fewer false steps than his college tapes. Looks like he’s gaining some better understanding.

Assuming film study and repetitive practice on keys. I expected his lack of experience and instincts to lead to break down after breakdown for multiple seasons as he learned to play the position.

My general feeling is he must be putting in effort and receptive to coaching. I do feel like I’m seeing consistent motor/effort. Playing through the whistle. Not getting down on mistakes and obviously letting them compound.

I appreciate seeing a play by play breakdown by someone who understands what they are seeing. It sounds like he’s showing some understanding for coverage concepts and responsibilities that are also encouraging.

Definitely interested in what he was seeing/thinking on a couple of those snaps. Again though, I was really down on this pick and what I perceive as his high motor is helping me turn that around.

I hung my hat on what I heard of his work ethic/desire. At least that seems to be accurate. If the kid stays healthy and keeps working hard, I’m now much more confident he will become a high level ilb.

Better?
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby TheChefO » Thu Nov 07, 2019 4:24 pm

Natural Selection wrote:This is why I keep checking the forum.

Awesome read.
Excellent analysis.
I greatly appreciate the effort put in to this post.

Thank you!

*****

I’m honestly more pleased with what I’ve seen from 45 than I expected.

He does seem to me to have cleaned up a lot of his pursuit angles.
I see way fewer false steps than his college tapes.
Looks like he’s gaining some better understanding.
Assuming film study and repetitive practice on keys.

I expected his lack of experience and instincts to lead to break down after breakdown for multiple seasons as he learned to play the position.

My general feeling is he must be putting in effort and receptive to coaching.

I do feel like I’m seeing consistent motor/effort.
Playing through the whistle.
Not getting down on mistakes and obviously letting them compound.

I really appreciate reading a play by play breakdown by someone who understands what they are seeing.

It sounds like he’s showing some understanding for coverage concepts and responsibilities that are also encouraging.
Definitely interested in what he was seeing/thinking on a couple of those snaps.

Again though, I was really down on this pick and what I perceive as his high motor is helping me turn that around.
I hung my hat on what I heard of his work ethic/desire.
At least that seems to be accurate.

If the kid stays healthy and keeps working hard, I’m now much more confident he will become a high level ilb.


Better.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Cheb » Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:15 pm

Second quarter time. Let's get back into it.

3rd and one. Trips in tight on the right, singleback behind Wilson who is under center. We're in base personnel. The Seahawks again go with a playaction fake to the their left, then rollout to the right, again they try to rub the defender who is supposed to be covering the guy in the right flat. You know who caught on right away? Devin White. We are in Cover-1 man here, and White is supposed to be sitting in the middle of the field, but he reads this concept very quickly, probably because he's seen it twice already this game. He fast-flows to where the ball is designed to go (the right flat) before the ball even leaves Wilson's hand. We stop it for a minimal gain, though still a first down. Devin White gets a nice assisted tackle here. Good play recognition by him.

1st and ten. Shotgun, 12 personnel, Carson in a sidecar left. Playaction fake on outside zone action to the right side. Metcalf runs deep to clear out the safety, Lockett runs a route versus air for an easy first down. We were in Cover-1 man (surprise!). White was responsible for the tight end, who stayed in to block. White just hung out in a hook zone and did nothing to effect the play. Not really his fault. He did his job, just a bit disappointing is all.

If we intend to run this style of defense consistently, we need a dynamic free safety who reacts and covers ground far quicker. Adams ain't that guy, and neither is Edwards. I digress. onto the next first down.

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1st-and-ten. An end around to the offensive left for a gain of seven. White reads the tight end flowing towards the playside to block Shaq, and he gets himself into a decent position to get to the ball.

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Here we are at the point where the wideout gets the ball. And keep in mind that Devin has seen this coming.

White is the black circle. He has two options to disengage the block here; rip through (the red arrow), or try to spin out of it (blue arrow). Notice how his hips are past the tackle's, the guy trying to block him. Because of that, the decision should be self-evident. If your hips are past your man's hips, go past and through him. You have have heard the term that the blocker has "opened the gate," and this is it right here. Imagine as if he's waving you through a narrow doorway to let you walk past him. When he does this, it behooves you to step through.

If you're "through the gate" and try to spin out (the blue arrow), he will have leverage and will ride you ragged the rest of the snap. If you're not through the gate and you try to rip through it (the red arrow), you won't get there in time.

Devin shoulda gone red. Rip through, and made the TFL. He went blue instead. And he got rode ragged the rest of the snap. Whodathunk?

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2nd-and-three. Another run. Here's the formation in the box prior to the snap.

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Here we have the Seahawks play, a counter to the left. #82 leads the way. The picture explains it in more detail; our gap assignments in red, their blocking assignments in blue, and the path of the runner in orange.

Let's see what happens.

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Here we are further into the run. Devin saw this action coming, and did a savvy move; he hid behind Shaq Barrett (red circle). Thus #82 (blue circle) totally whiffed the block; he arrived across the formation to find his man nowhere to be found. By the time he found him, when this photo was took, it should've been over.

Let's look at Shaq here, in that red circle. He crashed his gap so hard that he nearly blew this play up all by himself, hitting Carson early right after this. Carson did spin out of it to his credit.

The stage was set for Devin White to pop out of hiding and finish off Carson. But he doesn't, and the clue as to why is in the photo. Look at White's positioning; he's peeking into Barrett's gap. He's not ready to take on the back in his own gap responsibility (the green arrow). He's instead trying to play Barrett's assignment, where Barrett happens to be. Let's look at Devin when he makes contact with Carson.

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Again I'm a bit hamstrung by not being able to make gifs showing the tackle attempt. Hopefully the picture is illuminating. This is where White (pink circle of shame) makes contact with Carson.

In essence, because of White not taking responsibility for his gap, instead trying to play Barrett's for him, his feet and hips weren't ready for a tackle in his own responsibility. See how far back his feet are, and how he didn't make contact squarely? That's due to his prior mistake.

Can Devin White tackle Carson high? Probably. Should he? Maybe not. Should he when he's out of position and not properly square? Not a wise decision.

Carson shrugs off the tackle attempt by White, and LVD (red circle) gets picked up by #82 (blue circle), the guy who was originally supposed to block White.

What should have been a TFL or minimal gain of one or two yards was instead a ten yard gain, because White fucked up. This was right at his gap.

Derrick Brooks once said in an interview that his best statistical season was his worst as a player, because even though he got many tackles, he was trying to play another guys' gap assignment in addition to his own, and that made the defense fundamentally weaker. Instead of full-assing one thing, he half-assed two things. When Brooks learned to trust the guy next to him, his own stats diminished but slightly, while the defense became much stronger.

White needs to talk to Derrick Brooks. Preferably at length.

---

1st-and-ten again. Shotgun, 11 personnel, trips right. PA zone fake to the left, which White follows. Guess what defense we're in? If you guessed Cover-1 man, you get a cookie. The back leaks out into the flat, White covers it well.

For the second time this game, our safeties switch responsibilities when a receiver crosses the midline. Let me explain. Darian Stewart was in man coverage on Lockett, already a mismatch. At the top of his stem, Lockett commits blatant OPI, pushing off against Stewart. Lockett crosses the midline of the field, and Whitehead, who is flatfooted, now has to cover Lockett, who is running at full speed across the field. Wilson set his feet and overthrew Lockett, who was wide open on the crosser.

We've done this swapping of assignments in the secondary at least twice already, and the guy who receives the assignment is always positionally fucked. This needs tinkering in the DB room, and quickly.

White did fine.

---
2nd-and-10. 11 personnel, shotgun, sidecar left. A simple draw play to the running back. White got in on the assisted tackle after Suh made the initial hit. The run was right at White's gap (again). White needs to work on keeping his chest clean, and fighting through blocks instead of trying to ride them out laterally. Sometimes you've just gotta work through it, my son. Had he been more aggressive here, the gain would have been minimal. But White seems to prefer to avoid contact instead of really getting in there. Had he played this downhill, and trusted his eyes when the center released downfield right at his face, he could have been much more aggressive here to cover his gap. This was a five yard gain that coulda been a two yard gain had White reacted quicker.

3rd and 5. Five wide, empty backfield, trips left. We're in a 5-1-5. White is off the field. We're in Cover-1 man (no way!). The Seahawks knew that would be the defense we're in, and easily isolated Metcalf on Dean for the pitch-and-catch, but he catches it out of bounds. Fieldgoal is next play

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Next drive, we're up 21-7.

First play is Lockett on a slant route versus Vernon in Cover-1 man (no way, how unanticipated), easy 11 yard gain. White's in man on the back, but it doesn't matter. Why throw to your running back when your receivers can get first downs at will?

1st and ten again. Shotgun, 12 personnel, sidecar left, versus our base personnel. Seahawks pull the backside tackle and run a power to the right. White reads it right, meets the puller in the hole, keeps his gapside arm free, and forces the run inside to his help, LVD. LVD makes the tackle. Textbook defense. Good job rookie.

2nd-and-six, where Beau and Shaq share a sack. PA zone fake left. Their center kinda fucks up, doesn't help his guard, and Beau gets in first. Good team pressure here. White was rushing and did an okay job I guess, but he was not the star on this play.

---

Now it's 3rd-and-13, where Devin gets his sack. Shotgun, trips turns into quads left due to motioning the back out to the left. We're in nickel, Cover-1 man defense (no way!). LVD actually tells him and White to swap responsibilities prior to the snap, which was smart. Now White is in the hole, LVD in coverage versus Carson. A good swap.

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White starts the snap just reading Wilson. He reads his eyes and floats to where Wilson is looking, to the left. When White realizes that he has no one between him and the QB, he starts rushing, as well he should. Shaq Barrett (blue circle) has his man beat and is running the circle, while JPP (yellow circle) is working his way through the trash. Shaq is the first one to pressure Wilson, then White and JPP host a party at the quarterback.

This forces a punt.

---

We're still up 21-7 on the next defensive possession, 1:43 left in the half.

1st and ten, shotgun, trips left, sidecar right. Nickel personnel, Cover-1 man (no way!). Seattle runs another rub concept to Lockett, picking on our rookie Dean, for an easy ten-yard gain. Given how predictable our defense is, this is hardly surprising. Even Ray Charles could see what our defense is going to be every down, and he's both blind and dead.

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We run a six man pressure, which White is a part of. He and Suh both try to clumsily rush through the same right-side A gap, with White basically running into Suh's butt. See above photo.

---

The next play is a run to Carson. White was away from the action, but maintained his gap responsibility.

Next we have 2nd-and-5. 11 personnel again. Cover-1 man defense again. Another rub concept targeting Dean, this time to David More. We run a six man pressure, White and LVD run a twist stunt through the A-gaps, good rushes but better blocks by Seattle. Six yard gain, first down.

---

1st and ten, where we come to the huge pass interference on White. The Seahawks are in shotgun, trips right. We are in some kinda Franken defense again, like in the first quarter when I was complaining.

Look at this ****:

Image

You could argue that this is some sort of pattern matching. But in pattern matching, you respond to the receiver's routes. If they stem vertically, you are basically in man coverage on whatever vertical route they are running. If this is pattern matching, then the hook-curl defender in the blue circle should be running vertically with the #2 receiver (the blue square), instead of settling into a hook-curl zone. But he doesn't.

Devin White's assignment certainly has the characteristics of pattern matching. As we said, in pattern matching, when your receiver goes vertical, you run with him. On the snap, White immediately looked to the number 3 receiver, the yellow circle. When I say #3 receiver, I mean the third receiver from the outside of the formation, counting outside to inside. I put reminders on the picture above.

Anyways, White looks immediately on the snap at the yellow circle, and seems surprised when the #3 receiver releases vertically. Moreover, he's late to flip his hips and run with him. Because of that, White is running behind the receiver the entire snap. He panics, and he gets a bit grabby near the goal line.

The DPI was justifiable, as White definitely did commit defensive pass interference. But I wonder what the **** kinda defense this is, and what rules it has. It seems very... odd. Yes, let's call it odd.

Did White commit this penalty? Yes. Could he have played it better? Yes. Should he have panicked? No. But do I blame him for this one? Not really. I wonder what the **** Bowles is doing here.

---

Now we're on the goalline, 1st and 1 to score. The first play was a dud, as Shaq was apparently offsides. On the second play, the Hawks ran a PA zone run fake to the left, then a short dumpoff to the right. Gee, if only we could have anticipated this ****, especially on short down-and-distance. This is what, the sixth time they've done this concept this game? Easy catch at TD.

And that's the half.

I gotta get to practice. Big game tomorrow.

Thoughts? Opinions? Are your teeth so thoroughly gnashed that they are just stumps now?

I'll try to get to the second half tomorrow.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:15 pm

Every time we're in cover 1 on Sunday, chug a beer.

You'll need it.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Mountaineer Buc » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:27 pm

Real question.

Is the cover one possibly a reaction to the formation the Seahawks are using? Seems like a lot of trips with Carson as the sidecar over and over as well.

Is Bowles setting this defense up to simply read/react and positive plays are coming when somebody blows an assignment?

I ask because the theme I keep seeing is the play is set for a short/no gain IF everybody gets their reads right and makes the right decisions. Makes me think this is an evaluation season on defense while Leftwich is freelancing with the playcalling.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Snake » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:31 pm

Not impressed by Bowles. He thinks we have Ed Reed back there? White probably shouldn’t have been in that position on the DPI.

Good **** Cheb
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Rocker » Thu Nov 07, 2019 9:55 pm

Mountaineer Buc wrote:Every time we're in cover 1 on Sunday, chug a beer.

You'll need it.


Even professionals like you and I wouldn’t last the half.

Counter: every time we send more than two blitzers, finish your drink.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby MJW » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:38 pm

Two running themes:

- We're using Cover 1 too often.
- Devin White will be fine once he learns to trust his teammates and assignments, and not try to do everything at once.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby terrytate » Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:35 am

MJW wrote:Two running themes:

- We're using Cover 1 too often.
- Devin White will be fine once he learns to trust his teammates and assignments, and not try to do everything at once.


And, learn to tackle correctly. That "hit em high and flop" move might work on the starting RB at Valdosta State but Chris Carson just showed him it doesn't work in the NFL.

We knew he was a project from the beginning. He seems to have the right attitude and his physical gifts leap off the screen. At this point, all we can do is hope he figures it out.

Also, some mandatory love for Vea.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby TheChefO » Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:48 am

Cheb wrote:Thoughts? Opinions?


Excellent breakdowns as usual Cheb.
Thanks for putting in the work and taking us to school.

I'd be interested in seeing something like this for Bowles prior work as DC/HC for the Jets when they had success and/or other consistently great Defenses that have had changes in DC and personnel but still stayed a consistent top tier defense.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby LynchysKiss » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:43 am

You’re a beaut, much appreciated!
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 12:11 pm

Yeah yeah yeah, I knew you'd do a good job Cheb, now when do I get another star next to Vea...
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby mdb1958 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 7:29 pm

I know it's a lot of time and effort, so thanks Cheb.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby PetePierson » Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:27 am

Cheb - you and I don’t really get along / like one another but I know how much time it must take to create these threads.
You’re still a pompous **** but thank you.

Sorry, I felt I was being too nice and it was icky.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby MJW » Sat Nov 09, 2019 7:15 am

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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Terp » Sat Nov 09, 2019 7:41 am

Whole lotta Bucs kicker going on in here
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby LavonteDavid54 » Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:08 pm

My thoughts thus far are exactly what I expected.
He will need a year atleast to try and just play . Not to try and overthink .
If nothing else wasn’t he to be used as a weapon to get after the QB in our “ new” and improved defense ?
That usually is something naturally a rookie could do.
I don’t know if that aspect of his game is all on him though. The coaching in my opinion has been AWFUL from Todd Bowles.
If he was coveted over Josh Allen Id expect him to be in looks where he is getting more pressure on the QB.

My feeling always has been ,he doesn’t have the “ it” factor to instinctively read it a second before everyone else.
The special ones have that. He has size and speed that should make him an above average player at best.
Just didn’t see the perennial All Pro hype that was coming with him.

I do find myself feeling bad for him because he seems like he respects the game and gives 110%.
I’ll always appreciate someone who gets after it all the time.

Not to get completely off D. Whites play but we got pigeon holed with him due to Kwon and having ZERO
foresight to address the position for two years.
If Kwon was under contract would TB still have had him as the BPA ?

If nothing else we don’t have to draft for need there, he’ll be a solid ILB.
Just gotta wonder how often does an SEC DPOY fall in your lap who happens to play the second most coveted position on the chess board behind QB.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby real bucs fan » Sat Nov 09, 2019 11:00 pm

LavonteDavid54 wrote:My thoughts thus far are exactly what I expected.
He will need a year atleast to try and just play . Not to try and overthink .
If nothing else wasn’t he to be used as a weapon to get after the QB in our “ new” and improved defense ?
That usually is something naturally a rookie could do.
I don’t know if that aspect of his game is all on him though. The coaching in my opinion has been AWFUL from Todd Bowles.
If he was coveted over Josh Allen Id expect him to be in looks where he is getting more pressure on the QB.

My feeling always has been ,he doesn’t have the “ it” factor to instinctively read it a second before everyone else.
The special ones have that. He has size and speed that should make him an above average player at best.
Just didn’t see the perennial All Pro hype that was coming with him.

I do find myself feeling bad for him because he seems like he respects the game and gives 110%.
I’ll always appreciate someone who gets after it all the time.

Not to get completely off D. Whites play but we got pigeon holed with him due to Kwon and having ZERO
foresight to address the position for two years.
If Kwon was under contract would TB still have had him as the BPA ?

If nothing else we don’t have to draft for need there, he’ll be a solid ILB.
Just gotta wonder how often does an SEC DPOY fall in your lap who happens to play the second most coveted position on the chess board behind QB.

Licht handcuffed himself in regards to Kwon, by not having any cap space. To have such a **** year and have to use a 5th overall to replace a 4th rounder was rough. White will be a quality playmaker himself, but he’s hardly some massive upgrade on Kwon. And passing on a guy like Allen is awful since you rarely get the chance to add an edge of that caliber. Allen is the best edge prospect we’ve ever had on the board for us for as long as I’ve been a Bucs fan. And we chose to pass on him in order to make a lateral move at LB. Terrible.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby mdb1958 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:54 am

terrytate wrote:
MJW wrote:Two running themes:

- We're using Cover 1 too often.
- Devin White will be fine once he learns to trust his teammates and assignments, and not try to do everything at once.


And, learn to tackle correctly. That "hit em high and flop" move might work on the starting RB at Valdosta State but Chris Carson just showed him it doesn't work in the NFL.

We knew he was a project from the beginning. He seems to have the right attitude and his physical gifts leap off the screen. At this point, all we can do is hope he figures it out.

Also, some mandatory love for Vea.


Umm, who is that guy who talks about how important 7th round draft picks are?

Umm, how many 2020 7th rounders do we have?

To me this is how Licht makes himself look bad.


Ohh --- dont forget to laugh about DivII!
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby Caradoc » Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:45 am

real bucs fan wrote:Licht handcuffed himself in regards to Kwon, by not having any cap space. To have such a **** year and have to use a 5th overall to replace a 4th rounder was rough. White will be a quality playmaker himself, but he’s hardly some massive upgrade on Kwon. And passing on a guy like Allen is awful since you rarely get the chance to add an edge of that caliber. Allen is the best edge prospect we’ve ever had on the board for us for as long as I’ve been a Bucs fan. And we chose to pass on him in order to make a lateral move at LB. Terrible.



Sorry, but I am going to have to push back on this. It is 2019. Nobody "has to use a 5th overall pick" replace a middle linebacker. That's not how this works. We could have easily drafted Oliver or Allen and let Minter play. White was the wrong choice, but he wasn't a "forced"choice. Licht didn't "handcuff" himself into replacing a mediocre MLB with a top 5 pick.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby terrytate » Mon Nov 11, 2019 2:04 am

Caradoc wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:Licht handcuffed himself in regards to Kwon, by not having any cap space. To have such a **** year and have to use a 5th overall to replace a 4th rounder was rough. White will be a quality playmaker himself, but he’s hardly some massive upgrade on Kwon. And passing on a guy like Allen is awful since you rarely get the chance to add an edge of that caliber. Allen is the best edge prospect we’ve ever had on the board for us for as long as I’ve been a Bucs fan. And we chose to pass on him in order to make a lateral move at LB. Terrible.



Sorry, but I am going to have to push back on this. It is 2019. Nobody "has to use a 5th overall pick" replace a middle linebacker. That's not how this works. We could have easily drafted Oliver or Allen and let Minter play. White was the wrong choice, but he wasn't a "forced"choice. Licht didn't "handcuff" himself into replacing a mediocre MLB with a top 5 pick.



Let's not gloss over the fact that White came in as a very raw prospect and then missed time with injury. The man is starting to make some plays and may be a stud in the long run.

As I said, my biggest gripe is that there were two elite MLB prospects with top shelf speed. The only team likely to take one was Pitt. We should have explored trade back options and so far as I know, we didn't.
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Re: Coaches' Corner: Devin White vs the Seahawks

Postby TheChefO » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:58 pm

Caradoc wrote:
real bucs fan wrote:Licht handcuffed himself in regards to Kwon, by not having any cap space. To have such a **** year and have to use a 5th overall to replace a 4th rounder was rough. White will be a quality playmaker himself, but he’s hardly some massive upgrade on Kwon. And passing on a guy like Allen is awful since you rarely get the chance to add an edge of that caliber. Allen is the best edge prospect we’ve ever had on the board for us for as long as I’ve been a Bucs fan. And we chose to pass on him in order to make a lateral move at LB. Terrible.



Sorry, but I am going to have to push back on this. It is 2019. Nobody "has to use a 5th overall pick" replace a middle linebacker. That's not how this works. We could have easily drafted Oliver or Allen and let Minter play. White was the wrong choice, but he wasn't a "forced"choice. Licht didn't "handcuff" himself into replacing a mediocre MLB with a top 5 pick.



As much as I think Licht has been horrible on draft day, it is way too soon to state this. In hindsight, maybe, but if White does grow into this role and his elite athletic ability is paired with a will/drive to get better ever day, the sky is the limit. Granted, humble beginnings don't point here yet, but many said Barber didn't belong in this league based on his rookie year too.
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