***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:24 am

Deuce wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:Why do you keep repeating this?

I've said twice he would have gotten more, but not likely a lot more. He valued winning over potentially $5+ million additional.

I do believe that NO didn't make him an official offer, maybe they discussed a potential range, but him and his agent coming out and saying he was offended they didn't give him an offer is too easily disputable to not believe.


It's too easily disputable to not believe? What does that even mean? It's being disputed lol Cousins and his agent are putting this "no one wanted me" narrative out there in an attempt to deflect some of the backlash, when he took less money than he could've gotten elsewhere to join GSW. We're 3 days into free agency.

Listen. I'm sorry you are upset he didn't go to Houston and that Houston now is unlikely to beat GS. You are obviously struggling to follow this conversation.

I said he could have gotten more money, but multiple sources are reporting he had 0 offers when players like Julius Randle and Rondo have been offered by multiple teams. He made a choice to play for the MLE. If you dispute any of that we can continue, but otherwise you are just talking in circles.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:25 am

While I certainly get the frustration with superteans getting richer, particularly knowing my Cavs might not be relevant again for 30 years, I just don’t know any feasible way to prevent them.


The NBA already has the worst teams get first pic, theya already have a cap (albeit a stupid soft one), etc

So what other options are out there to prevent this?

1.). Going to a hard cap like the NFL
2.). Commish getting to veto any signing trade he wants

#1 might work, #2 certainly won’t.


The biggest driver in this is the insane amount of money NBA players make. After they play 1 big contract (or even medium contract) they have FU money and money can become secondary quicker for them then in other sports. As such they can pick and choose what else is important for them - winning in a super team, moving close to home, playing with buddies, etc
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:28 am

uscbucsfan wrote:LA and Boston have always had a leg up due to their city/history. It's why players like Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, or Miken signed there. It's why Malone, Peyton, or Atrest went there for less in attempts to get a ring.

I get why some fans are upset, but if you look through history of the league, this is normal. GSW doesn't even have the most stacked team in history as far as all stars. The 76 Celtics had 6.

GSW will likely break up in the next two years when Durant, Klay, and Draymond look for new contracts, but there will be new super teams.

Edit: Lakers and Celtics have 33 of 70 NBA titles. That's pretty insane.


Really? How many teams have won 73 games and then signed an MVP in his prime?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:31 am

Zarniwoop wrote:While I certainly get the frustration with superteans getting richer, particularly knowing my Cavs might not be relevant again for 30 years, I just don’t know any feasible way to prevent them.


The NBA already has the worst teams get first pic, theya already have a cap (albeit a stupid soft one), etc

So what other options are out there to prevent this?

1.). Going to a hard cap like the NFL
2.). Commish getting to veto any signing trade he wants

#1 might work, #2 certainly won’t.


The biggest driver in this is the insane amount of money NBA players make. After they play 1 big contract (or even medium contract) they have FU money and money can become secondary quicker for them then in other sports. As such they can pick and choose what else is important for them - winning in a super team, moving close to home, playing with buddies, etc


Hard cap/getting rid of the max contract
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:36 am

uscbucsfan wrote:
Deuce wrote:
It's too easily disputable to not believe? What does that even mean? It's being disputed lol Cousins and his agent are putting this "no one wanted me" narrative out there in an attempt to deflect some of the backlash, when he took less money than he could've gotten elsewhere to join GSW. We're 3 days into free agency.

Listen. I'm sorry you are upset he didn't go to Houston and that Houston now is unlikely to beat GS. You are obviously struggling to follow this conversation.

I said he could have gotten more money, but multiple sources are reporting he had 0 offers when players like Julius Randle and Rondo have been offered by multiple teams. He made a choice to play for the MLE. If you dispute any of that we can continue, but otherwise you are just talking in circles.


lol every time I disagree with you, you bring up things we've talked about in the past like they matter. I'm not mad he didn't sign with Houston. I wish he would've stayed in NO, really.

You seem to have a decent grip on football. You should really stick to that.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:41 am

Deuce wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:Listen. I'm sorry you are upset he didn't go to Houston and that Houston now is unlikely to beat GS. You are obviously struggling to follow this conversation.

I said he could have gotten more money, but multiple sources are reporting he had 0 offers when players like Julius Randle and Rondo have been offered by multiple teams. He made a choice to play for the MLE. If you dispute any of that we can continue, but otherwise you are just talking in circles.


lol every time I disagree with you, you bring up things we've talked about in the past like they matter. I'm not mad he didn't sign with Houston. I wish he would've stayed in NO, really.

You seem to have a decent grip on football. You should really stick to that.

What did I bring up from the past?

You are obviosuly hyper agressive to anything I say. You haven't even made an argument against anything I said, you are attempting to attack me.

You are just the king at passive aggressive shots. I love it.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:48 am

uscbucsfan wrote:
Deuce wrote:
lol every time I disagree with you, you bring up things we've talked about in the past like they matter. I'm not mad he didn't sign with Houston. I wish he would've stayed in NO, really.

You seem to have a decent grip on football. You should really stick to that.

What did I bring up from the past?

You are obviosuly hyper agressive to anything I say. You haven't even made an argument against anything I said, you are attempting to attack me.

You are just the king at passive aggressive shots. I love it.


I threw a harmless joke your way the other day and you said I was salty because of the landlord thread, which was from like a year ago and I didn't even remember that you posted in.

Then you blamed the Cousins thing on me being a Rockets fan.

But I'm the one who holds grudges and is passive aggressive. mmkay
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:52 am

Deuce wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:What did I bring up from the past?

You are obviosuly hyper agressive to anything I say. You haven't even made an argument against anything I said, you are attempting to attack me.

You are just the king at passive aggressive shots. I love it.


I threw a harmless joke your way the other day and you said I was salty because of the landlord thread, which was from like a year ago and I didn't even remember that you posted in.

Then you blamed the Cousins thing on me being a Rockets fan.

But I'm the one who holds grudges and is passive aggressive. mmkay

Seems like you just brought up a past event.

I initially said you were salty in jest, but I see it offended you.

We have been talking about your Rockets fandom within this conversation when you mentioned Harden in an extremely homerish way.

Again, calm down and follow the conversation. You seemingly miss that I continue to agree with you Cousins would have received more money elsewhere.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:57 am

uscbucsfan wrote:What did I bring up from the past?


Deuce wrote: I threw a harmless joke your way the other day and you said I was salty because of the landlord thread, which was from like a year ago and I didn't even remember that you posted in.

Then you blamed the Cousins thing on me being a Rockets fan.

But I'm the one who holds grudges and is passive aggressive. mmkay


uscbucsfan wrote:Seems like you just brought up a past event.


You have a habit of posting things in a factual way that are actually what you think, then turn out to be very wrong. There are numerous examples.

I'm gonna do myself a favor. This is my last reply to you.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:59 am

Deuce wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:What did I bring up from the past?


Deuce wrote: I threw a harmless joke your way the other day and you said I was salty because of the landlord thread, which was from like a year ago and I didn't even remember that you posted in.

Then you blamed the Cousins thing on me being a Rockets fan.

But I'm the one who holds grudges and is passive aggressive. mmkay


uscbucsfan wrote:Seems like you just brought up a past event.


You have a habit of posting things in a factual way that are actually what you think, then turn out to be very wrong. There are numerous examples.

I'm gonna do myself a favor. This is my last reply to you.

Lol.

It's just a message board.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby PrimeMinister » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:40 am

You two seem to be messaging very well.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:33 am

PrimeMinister wrote:You two seem to be messaging very well.



Deuce and USC sitting in a tree.....

:P
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:39 am

Zarniwoop wrote:
PrimeMinister wrote:You two seem to be messaging very well.



Deuce and USC sitting in a tree.....

:P

Reported
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:42 am

You made me switch over to full style just so I could like that
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:19 pm

Deuce wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:Why do you keep repeating this?

I've said twice he would have gotten more, but not likely a lot more. He valued winning over potentially $5+ million additional.

I do believe that NO didn't make him an official offer, maybe they discussed a potential range, but him and his agent coming out and saying he was offended they didn't give him an offer is too easily disputable to not believe.


It's too easily disputable to not believe? What does that even mean? It's being disputed lol Cousins and his agent are putting this "no one wanted me" narrative out there in an attempt to deflect some of the backlash, when he took less money than he could've gotten elsewhere to join GSW. We're 3 days into free agency.


So what are you saying? That he should've waited for teams to start calling before reaching out to the Warriors? And what is your proof that he and his agent are lying?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Deuce » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:42 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Deuce wrote:
It's too easily disputable to not believe? What does that even mean? It's being disputed lol Cousins and his agent are putting this "no one wanted me" narrative out there in an attempt to deflect some of the backlash, when he took less money than he could've gotten elsewhere to join GSW. We're 3 days into free agency.


So what are you saying? That he should've waited for teams to start calling before reaching out to the Warriors? And what is your proof that he and his agent are lying?


It's just a stretch for me to believe the "no team wanted me" narrative when we're on day 3 of free agency. I don't think he was getting the max anywhere but I believe he'd get much more than $5 mil. I think he didn't get offered the max, got upset and reached out to the Warriors for the easy year/title with perhaps a twist of "I'll show them." I think this "no team wanted me" thing was thought up afterward to save face.

The team says they discussed a potential salary with him. So it's up to you on who you believe, him or the team.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby uscbucsfan » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:52 pm

Deuce wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
So what are you saying? That he should've waited for teams to start calling before reaching out to the Warriors? And what is your proof that he and his agent are lying?


The team says they discussed a potential salary with him. So it's up to you on who you believe, him or the team.

Discussed a potential salary =/= an offer. Both the team and him are believable in this scenario.

According to Fletcher Mackel

Pelicans DISCUSSED numbers w/ Boogie & his reps.
Cousins camp didn’t like those numbers.
Both sides agreed, test FA.
Humbling experience for DC.
NOLA pivoted to Randle.
Pelicans wanted sign & trade deal.
Boogie & his camp walked.
Took GSW $5.3 mil

He later said no official offer was made, but the Pelicans had told him they would extend an offer for 12-17 million once they found a trade partner for a sign and trade.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Phantom Phenom » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:30 pm

Wilson Chandler traded from Nuggets to Sixers
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:48 pm

Deuce wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:
So what are you saying? That he should've waited for teams to start calling before reaching out to the Warriors? And what is your proof that he and his agent are lying?


It's just a stretch for me to believe the "no team wanted me" narrative when we're on day 3 of free agency. I don't think he was getting the max anywhere but I believe he'd get much more than $5 mil. I think he didn't get offered the max, got upset and reached out to the Warriors for the easy year/title with perhaps a twist of "I'll show them." I think this "no team wanted me" thing was thought up afterward to save face.

The team says they discussed a potential salary with him. So it's up to you on who you believe, him or the team.


Or it's up to you to devise your own narrative of the events, which is what you're doing here. Nothing to see here other than you talking out of your ass.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Swashy » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:56 pm

Obvious Cousins motive is obvious regardless of what anyone says. We can debate the topic in any number of ways and no matter what Cousins went to GSW because it was his choice. No one forced this decision. When we review the facts we can see he went to a powerhouse for a fraction of what players like himself command in salary. No one put a gun to his head and said "Sign to GSW for $5 million" and to think he would not/could not have gotten better is fooling themselves. Truth be told it's a genius plan by Cousins because I think anyone would pounce on such a big opportunity. But from a competitive standpoint it's a cop out and a "**** you" to any fans who had hopes that next year might be different.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:01 pm

Swashy wrote:Obvious Cousins motive is obvious regardless of what anyone says. We can debate the topic in any number of ways and no matter what Cousins went to GSW because it was his choice. No one forced this decision. When we review the facts we can see he went to a powerhouse for a fraction of what players like himself command in salary. No one put a gun to his head and said "Sign to GSW for $5 million" and to think he would not/could not have gotten better is fooling themselves. Truth be told it's a genius plan by Cousins because I think anyone would pounce on such a big opportunity. But from a competitive standpoint it's a cop out and a "**** you" to any fans who had hopes that next year might be different.


How can he possibly have a motive when he had no other options? I'll ask again, are you saying he should have just sat and waited for an offer to fall into his lap?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Swashy » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:32 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Swashy wrote:Obvious Cousins motive is obvious regardless of what anyone says. We can debate the topic in any number of ways and no matter what Cousins went to GSW because it was his choice. No one forced this decision. When we review the facts we can see he went to a powerhouse for a fraction of what players like himself command in salary. No one put a gun to his head and said "Sign to GSW for $5 million" and to think he would not/could not have gotten better is fooling themselves. Truth be told it's a genius plan by Cousins because I think anyone would pounce on such a big opportunity. But from a competitive standpoint it's a cop out and a "**** you" to any fans who had hopes that next year might be different.


How can he possibly have a motive when he had no other options? I'll ask again, are you saying he should have just sat and waited for an offer to fall into his lap?


I'm saying that he made his choice on his own. Free agency is the purest exercise of personal preference. Cousins had his opportunity and he took it. But it just so happens to be the dynasty was the only one to take the chance on a dominant big man that suddenly no one wanted anymore because of an injury? I don't buy it when Portland reportedly attempted a sign and trade. And I'm sure the Pelicans wanted him back after trading for him. Let's go with his old team too. The Kings not want him back after trading him? We can only deal in speculation but we can afford to be concrete when discussing talent like Cousins. You know better than anyone on this board that you DO NOT pass of talent when given the chance. That's also why he's a Warrior now. What were the numbers Cousins had seen before? That's speculation. But to introduce facts back into the matter, a free agent is free to make his choice regardless of the numbers given to him. To think only GSW would want one of the best centers in the league would be like me believing that LeBron did not take personal preference into account when signing with LA and Magic Johnson is this superior GM to all others that somehow convinced him to sign there above the other 29 teams that would get on their knees and beg him to play there. I'm not saying you're wrong but if it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck, has a green head and quacks it's probably a Mallard. I am very comfortable with assuming Boogie has a master plan and is betting on himself to return to form AND win a ring. And if you are as good as DeMarcus Cousins you'd be a damn idiot not to bet on yourself and prove to the world that you're still the man.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:37 pm

There’s an article on yahoo that according to Marc Stein said once he turned down the 2 year 40 million during the season the Pelicans didn’t really want to offer anything else. He wanted to go to the Lakers and talked to them and even though they have around $6M in cap space after the Rondo deal (or whatever that mid level is) they didn’t want to offer him.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Swashy » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:42 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:There’s an article on yahoo that according to Marc Stein said once he turned down the 2 year 40 million during the season the Pelicans didn’t really want to offer anything else. He wanted to go to the Lakers and talked to them and even though they have around $6M in cap space after the Rondo deal (or whatever that mid level is) they didn’t want to offer him.


Well **** can you blame them? If someone says no to that then it pretty much means "Yeah not interested in coming back"
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:01 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:There’s an article on yahoo that according to Marc Stein said once he turned down the 2 year 40 million during the season the Pelicans didn’t really want to offer anything else. He wanted to go to the Lakers and talked to them and even though they have around $6M in cap space after the Rondo deal (or whatever that mid level is) they didn’t want to offer him.


Did they offer that before or after he tore his Achilles?
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Zarniwoop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:04 pm

After the injury
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:12 pm

Zarniwoop wrote:After the injury


Exactly. They knew he wouldn’t except that offer for multiple reasons. 1, a player of his caliber is deserving of a max deal. And a max deal is what he will get next offseason from some team. There’s absolutely no reason for him to take a 2 year deal below his market value because of how much the cap increases next offseason and the fact that if all things go as planned the Pelicans would be getting Cousins at a huge discounted rate in 2019. He and his agent likely countered with a 1 year deal and the Pelicans balked.

Swashy, that offer is great in the NFL. Great even in MLB. In the NBA it’s chump change. At such a low APY players often sign 1 year deals and cash in the next season. New Orleans tried getting off cheap there in 2019.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Swashy » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:36 pm

Bootz2004 wrote:
Zarniwoop wrote:After the injury
Swashy, that offer is great in the NFL. Great even in MLB. In the NBA it’s chump change. At such a low APY players often sign 1 year deals and cash in the next season. New Orleans tried getting off cheap there in 2019.


In their defense he blew out his Achilles but I digress to the fact that elite talent always deserves to be paid as such. But in any case the fact he went and settled for $5 million with GSW tells me all I need to know that Cousins exercised the power of personal decision and not necessarily because they were his only option.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Bootz2004 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:48 pm

Swashy wrote:
Bootz2004 wrote:Swashy, that offer is great in the NFL. Great even in MLB. In the NBA it’s chump change. At such a low APY players often sign 1 year deals and cash in the next season. New Orleans tried getting off cheap there in 2019.


In their defense he blew out his Achilles but I digress to the fact that elite talent always deserves to be paid as such. But in any case the fact he went and settled for $5 million with GSW tells me all I need to know that Cousins exercised the power of personal decision and not necessarily because they were his only option.


He’s betting on himself for 2019. He won’t be back with the Warriors next season. Everyone knows this.

Let’s assume that he is lying and he did receive other offers. I guarantee you they were all multi-year deals well below elite level value. Guarantee it. And probably without an opt-out.
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Re: ***OFFICIAL NBA 2018 OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Postby Super K » Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:00 am

So I saw something posted on Twitter that really summed up this "super team" dilemma pretty well..

Vegas has given the Cleveland Browns better odds to win the SB than 24 NBA teams to win the championship...

That's craziness...

As many have said, you can't fix this super team collaboration by limiting where players go or for how much (aside from having a hard cap)...so how does it get fixed?..

Again I propose shortening playoff series...3 games for rounds 1,2..5 games for the conference championships (maybe even the finals)...

"But Super K, you can't do that, the league won't give up that money!"

They won't have to..charge more..

Charge more for the TV rights for the shorter series...likewise more people will watch/tune in for more games in a shorter series..

Charge more for tickets.... upper level playoff tix to see Cavs/Pacers were 1/3 the cost of my upper level tix to see our Bucs vs Cleveland next year...

1/3 the cost for PLAYOFF tickets...

Hell, our lawn seats for concerts this summer we're almost double the cost of the playoff tix...


So, to summarize:

Shorten playoff series giving non-super teams a chance to pull off a great upset...

Charge more of a premium price for shortened series...

Problem solved...
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