*** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

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*** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Phantom Phenom » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:36 pm

Zion undergoes knee surgery to repair a torn meniscus and out for 6-8 weeks
Last edited by Phantom Phenom on Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:44 pm

I love China
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Phantom Phenom » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:48 pm

I have a feeling this is the Bucks year. Giannis is hungry for a ring.

But I wouldn’t rule out the Clippers for winning the Finals.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby acmillis » Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:09 am

DreadNaught wrote:I love China

Ban him!
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby PrimeMinister » Tue Oct 22, 2019 7:32 am

This is the first year in over 15 years that I feel 5-6 teams could actually win. This season should turn out to be the most openly competitive in decades.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Swashy » Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:06 am

PrimeMinister wrote:This is the first year in over 15 years that I feel 5-6 teams could actually win. This season should turn out to be the most openly competitive in decades.


Hear hear. It's finally truly interesting to be a basketball fan. There's the frontrunners sure but it's not like years past where I could've told you "it'll be Cavs vs Warriors again and again"
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby BJJ34 » Tue Oct 22, 2019 2:41 pm

The Warriors are going to miss the playoffs this year. They dont have the size to compete.

The Bucks are everyone's pick in the east. I'd say a healthy Pacers squad is interesting. They were awesome til Vic went down.

Interested to see how Rubio does with the Suns too. He's always been one of my favorite players. I love passing guards. Sue me.

I think the LA thing is overdrawn. George isnt healthy yet. Might not ever get there. Bron might be wearing down. Though a healthy him and AD is terrifying to think about. Danny Green just needs to hit his open jumpers.


The Celtics with Kemba excite me as well. How will he adapt to a new city. Theyve got a pretty good roster.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby BJJ34 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 10:00 am

Clippers take the first game of the new rivalry. Kawhi looked pretty great. LeBron looked himself for the most part. The Lakers need time to gel.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Phantom Phenom » Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:16 pm

Stephen Curry out for 3 months with injured hand
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby BJJ34 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 12:04 pm

The Suns are 5 and 2. Are they legitimate?
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby acmillis » Tue Nov 05, 2019 12:49 pm

BJJ34 wrote:The Suns are 5 and 2. Are they legitimate?

I could see them getting the 6 seed in the West.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 10:28 am

Russell Westbrook tried to call out Patrick Beverley for not being able to play defense, but it backfired.

According to ESPN when Beverley was on Harden, Harden was 0-6 with 4 turnovers. lol.

I doubt Westbrook cares, he's hilarious.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:37 am

Phantom Phenom wrote:Stephen Curry out for 3 months with injured hand

I don't watch NBA regular season but with no Curry, Klay (or Durant) we're about to see how elite Draymond Green really is I'm sure. :roll:
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:41 am

DreadNaught wrote:
Phantom Phenom wrote:Stephen Curry out for 3 months with injured hand

I don't watch NBA regular season but with no Curry, Klay (or Durant) we're about to see how elite Draymond Green really is I'm sure. :roll:

Draymond has been out for a while.

To argue he's not elite FOR THEM is kind of ridiculous. He's normally towards the top of the league as a defender, when needed can score, and is a great facilitator of that offense.

I don't know if anyone is arguing he could go an be a great player on his own, but he's the largest reason they've been one of the best defensive teams these last 5 years.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:46 am

uscbucsfan wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:I don't watch NBA regular season but with no Curry, Klay (or Durant) we're about to see how elite Draymond Green really is I'm sure. :roll:

Draymond has been out for a while.

To argue he's not elite FOR THEM is kind of ridiculous. He's normally towards the top of the league as a defender, when needed can score, and is a great facilitator of that offense.

I don't know if anyone is arguing he could go an be a great player on his own, but he's the largest reason they've been one of the best defensive teams these last 5 years.

He's elite, except when it comes to shooting the ball or scoring when he's being guarded. Got it.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:48 am

DreadNaught wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:Draymond has been out for a while.

To argue he's not elite FOR THEM is kind of ridiculous. He's normally towards the top of the league as a defender, when needed can score, and is a great facilitator of that offense.

I don't know if anyone is arguing he could go an be a great player on his own, but he's the largest reason they've been one of the best defensive teams these last 5 years.

He's elite, except when it comes to shooting the ball or scoring when he's being guarded. Got it.


There's a ton of players in that category that are still considered "elite" for what they do. It's part of basketball.

The Warriors wouldn't have been the Warriors without Draymond. No one is saying he's an elite scorer, but he's an elite defender, facilitator, motivator, and member of the team.

edit: You dislike Draymond, for whatever reason... I get it, but he's really ****ing good and valuable to the Warriors.

This was from 2017 I believe, but:

Warriors in playoffs
+153 w/Green on floor
-15 w/Green off floor

I
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Deuce » Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:54 am

Austin Rivers calling for a technical on his dad last night:

https://streamable.com/n11n9

First Rockets game I've watched this year and it was not short on entertainment. Harden hit clutch 3's. Patrick Beverly fouled out and then left the bench to argue with a ref, getting another technical. Doc Rivers was ejected. Harden threw an alley-oop to 37-year-old Tyson Chandler for the reverse jam.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:12 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:He's elite, except when it comes to shooting the ball or scoring when he's being guarded. Got it.


There's a ton of players in that category that are still considered "elite" for what they do. It's part of basketball.

The Warriors wouldn't have been the Warriors without Draymond. No one is saying he's an elite scorer, but he's an elite defender, facilitator, motivator, and member of the team.

edit: You dislike Draymond, for whatever reason... I get it, but he's really ****ing good and valuable to the Warriors.

This was from 2017 I believe, but:

Warriors in playoffs
+153 w/Green on floor
-15 w/Green off floor

I

I agree he's valuable to the Warriors b/c he does the dirty work. But he's Dennis Rodman-lite imo.

If Draymond Green didn't luck into being on the Warriors nobody would even know who he is. You can find guys that play defense and rebound.

Had Draymond spent his career in Orlando or Atlanta would you call him "elite"?
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:21 pm

DreadNaught wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:
There's a ton of players in that category that are still considered "elite" for what they do. It's part of basketball.

The Warriors wouldn't have been the Warriors without Draymond. No one is saying he's an elite scorer, but he's an elite defender, facilitator, motivator, and member of the team.

edit: You dislike Draymond, for whatever reason... I get it, but he's really ****ing good and valuable to the Warriors.

This was from 2017 I believe, but:

Warriors in playoffs
+153 w/Green on floor
-15 w/Green off floor

I

I agree he's valuable to the Warriors b/c he does the dirty work. But he's Dennis Rodman-lite imo.

If Draymond Green didn't luck into being on the Warriors nobody would even know who he is. You can find guys that play defense and rebound.

Had Draymond spent his career in Orlando or Atlanta would you call him "elite"?

Dennis Rodman is one of the greatest players to ever play (and wasn't a scorer). Draymond is a Rodman-lite with his grit and defense, but he's a far better offensive player than Rodman ever was.

He didn't play in Orlando or Atlanta, he played in GS and is one of the reason why the Warriors were the gold standard. We can do this for a ton of players in all sports. In Tampa Ronde Barber is a perfect example that the team and the system helped him and propped him up.

Again, I don't think I've ever heard anyone say Draymond would flourish elsewhere like they do with Klay or Steph, but he absolutely deserved his contract and is instrumental to that team. With his championships, 5 x all defensive teams, 2 time all pro, and defensive MVP, he's already a lock for the HOF (which is a joke in the NBA).

What's the point of your initial attack other than you not liking him as a person? The Warriors numbers with him on the floor vs. when he's not on the floor speak for themselves. The numbers say he's just as important in the last 5 years than Klay to their success.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:38 pm

DG is a fine defensive player and good rebounder. He's very fortunate he landed where he did b/c if he was required to be more than the 3rd best player on a team I don't think that team would even make the playoffs in a league where over 50% of the teams do.

Fwiw I don't view Rodman as an elite player. Like Draymond he was very valuable to teams with superstars that carried the offensive load. Elite defenders and rebounders? Sure. I agree with that. But Draymond is the guy every team doubles off of, so please don't make an argument about his offensive prowess. He's the worst offensive option for that team whenever he is on the floor. His game compliments that team very well the same way Rodman's did with those Pistons teams with Thomas/Dumars or Bulls teams with MJ.

Draymond is to that Warriors team what Horace Grant/Dennis Rodman were to those Bulls teams. If you consider that to be elite we can agree to disagree on that definition. Those guys were glorified role players who were elevated by the superstars that carried them.

I hope he returns soon and plays without Curry, Klay, and KD so can prove me wrong and show what an elite player he is.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:43 pm

All I've said about his offense is that he's a great facilitator and can score when needed. I also said he's better offensively than Rodman ever was, which is true.

On any other team Draymond is a more well rounded version of DeAndre Jordan. Coveted, but can't/won't carry a team.

To the last line in your posts, again, tell us where people have said he would carry a team elsewhere? What's your angle here?

Plenty of HOF players can't carry a team, it doesn't diminish their value. What has DG done that you are so hateful towards him to come in here and start an "I'm excited to see DG fail" declaration unprovoked?

edit: Looking into this further, DG has been ridiculously good in the playoffs. He's been the best player on the Warriors with +/- almost every year.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby acmillis » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:51 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:All I've said about his offense is that he's a great facilitator and can score when needed. I also said he's better offensively than Rodman ever was, which is true.

On any other team Draymond is a more well rounded version of DeAndre Jordan. Coveted, but can't/won't carry a team.

To the last line in your posts, again, tell us where people have said he would carry a team elsewhere? What's your angle here?

Plenty of HOF players can't carry a team, it doesn't diminish their value. What has DG done that you are so hateful towards him to come in here and start an "I'm excited to see DG fail" declaration unprovoked?


Rodman average 7.3PPG while Draymond has averaged 9.0, but Draymond's will only decrease as he gets older and worse offensively (if that is even possible).

Rodman's career FG% was 52.1%, while Draymond's (again, only gonna get worse) is 43.9%.

We're comparing apples to oranges as Green has played 7+ seasons while Rodman played 14, but saying Green is better than Rodman ever was is ridiculous. Both were/are offensive liabilities, but one dude shot 10 percentage points higher than the other.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby uscbucsfan » Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:55 pm

acmillis wrote:
uscbucsfan wrote:All I've said about his offense is that he's a great facilitator and can score when needed. I also said he's better offensively than Rodman ever was, which is true.

On any other team Draymond is a more well rounded version of DeAndre Jordan. Coveted, but can't/won't carry a team.

To the last line in your posts, again, tell us where people have said he would carry a team elsewhere? What's your angle here?

Plenty of HOF players can't carry a team, it doesn't diminish their value. What has DG done that you are so hateful towards him to come in here and start an "I'm excited to see DG fail" declaration unprovoked?


Rodman average 7.3PPG while Draymond has averaged 9.0, but Draymond's will only decrease as he gets older and worse offensively (if that is even possible).

Rodman's career FG% was 52.1%, while Draymond's (again, only gonna get worse) is 43.9%.

We're comparing apples to oranges as Green has played 7+ seasons while Rodman played 14, but saying Green is better than Rodman ever was is ridiculous. Both were/are offensive liabilities, but one dude shot 10 percentage points higher than the other.


1. Rodman didn't shoot 3s like Draymond.
2. Assists are absolutely a part of offensive production, which Draymond has more than double per game than Rodman.
3. Draymond can have and has (especially in the playoffs) outburst of scoring that Rodman wasn't capable of. Draymond averaged 14 ppg for a season a few years ago. DG averaged almost 16 ppg in the 2016 playoffs. Rodman's best was almost 9 in the playoffs.

and there's this:

All-time +/-:

Image

People underrate how good Draymond is...all the advanced stats say he's amazing, but like all stats they are without context of his surrounding talent. Very few people historically could take DG's place and value to the Warriors over the last 5 years. IMO that's elite in it's own sense. If you only define elite with scoring, that's fine...I just disagree.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:06 pm

uscbucsfan wrote:All I've said about his offense is that he's a great facilitator and can score when needed. I also said he's better offensively than Rodman ever was, which is true.

On any other team Draymond is a more well rounded version of DeAndre Jordan. Coveted, but can't/won't carry a team.

To the last line in your posts, again, tell us where people have said he would carry a team elsewhere? What's your angle here?

Plenty of HOF players can't carry a team, it doesn't diminish their value. What has DG done that you are so hateful towards him to come in here and start an "I'm excited to see DG fail" declaration unprovoked?

edit: Looking into this further, DG has been ridiculously good in the playoffs. He's been the best player on the Warriors with +/- almost every year.


I don't follow the NBA to have an opinion of who Draymond Green is off the court. So it's not a personal feeling or vendetta I have about him as a person.

My take on him is how overhyped he is as a basketball player. Like I've stated, he's been elevated based on his surroundings. I agree he's a good defender and rebounder and very valuable to that GSW team for those reasons.

The point you don't seem to acknowledge is those types of players (defense and rebounding specialists) are only valuable to teams carried by superstars, ala Rodman, Grant, Ben Wallace. DG is the modern version of that where everybody shoots 3pters and the game is opened up more. At the end of the day they all play the same 'role' for a championship caliber team.

If you take any of them and remove the superstars that carry those championship teams those squads become lottery teams. Which is why I don't consider them elite. But again, we probably disagree on how we're defining that term.

Without Curry and Klay the Warriors are a terrible team. If neither of them play this year GSW will be drafting top 5 next year.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby NYBF » Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:08 pm

DreadNaught wrote:[
I don't watch NBA regular season


So you clearly are the definitive source for what players are good or bad.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby DreadNaught » Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:13 pm

NYBF wrote:
DreadNaught wrote:I don't watch NBA regular season

So you clearly are the definitive source for what players are good or bad.

You're right, I'm sure Draymond will carry GS to the playoff this year without Curry and Klay.

I'll check back in few months to see how this goes.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Deuce » Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:28 pm

The Warriors were a great team. I think the team as a whole was greater than the sum of its parts.

Curry is probably the best shooter of all-time but he can't carry a team the way guys like LeBron, Durant, or Harden can. I would have liked to see him try this year, but he held up for less than 10 games, which is a part of the problem.

Klay is another great shooter but he could never be a #1 option on a team.

Draymond has the perfect set of skills to fit into what GS needed. He played the small-ball center role well, he's their best rebounder, and at times, he's been a good facilitator and even shot a decent 3-ball at some point. He's also a bulldog. At times, Curry, Klay, and Durant were too laid back, and Draymond would get them back into it. Would I call him elite? No. But he's the perfect fit for the "3rd best guy on a championship team" role.

They also had guys like Livingston and Iguodala, who were extremely important.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby BJJ34 » Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:55 pm

Iggy was massively underrated.

I think Golden State was the most dominant team I can ever remember. LeBron's the most dominant player I've ever seen though. Harden has more of the "what ridiculous **** is he going to pull.this time"going for him. He works hard though and when he tries defensively he can be a pest.
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby Phantom Phenom » Thu Nov 14, 2019 10:13 pm

Trail Blazers signing Carmelo Anthony to one year contract
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Re: *** OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA Thread ***

Postby acmillis » Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:47 am

Insert blink 182 wtf gif
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